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The Banter Page
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If you're wanting to get something off your chest, make general comments about the server, or post lonely hearts ads, then this is the place for you.
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None
What's all this bollocks about?
Dear John
Just in case you can't figure it out, try something a little more intellectually challenging.
None
[Bob the dog] OOOOOOoooooooOOOOOOOOOOh!
um
[Btd] Um ... Didn't you actually just insult all of us, rather than John? *scratches head in puzzlement*
Ire
Just venting spleen - no insult intended. Sarcasm does not travel well on the internet - I should know this by now.
None
Actually I've been thoroughly enjoying the virtual poppy plastic!
Movers and Shakers
I have to say, I'm seriously impressed by the rapid conversion of a soupçon of an idea in 'So Help Me God . . ' into a full-blown smorgasBoardgame of delights. Bravo all.
Cryptic answers
I've hidden all the answers and explanations in the source, for those who want guidance on crypticity.

Paying guest loses a fringe (6)
Vermin back in best Armenian families (4)
Mates in turmoil giving off vapour (5)
Tune on the radio ? (3)
WHERE THE EXECUTIONER'S AXE FALLS ? (5,7)
Food comes back as American time period (7)
Born in Little Rock, Arkansas - grew up in Colorado ! (7)
Darn fire is rubbish - more heat than light ! (5-3)

Sourcing
Cheers Blob. The mystery of No 7 is revealed at last.
Sound as a pound
I'm not convinced about the soundness of either no 5 or 7 - unless I'm being really dense. Is the second word of 5 clued by anything other than the orthography? Also the 5th word of 7 is not just redundant but destroys the clue.
clues
[rab] By orthography I take it you are referring to the capitalization, in which case, yep, that is the main clue - and is pretty much an accepted method of cluing - as is using punctuation in non-standard ways. The wording of the clue of course refers to the thing that the axeman's victim's head rests upon.
Arkansas ? What's wrong with that - that's where Little Rock is.
Solutions
[Blob] Well... the executioner is probably a matter of taste - I take the view that you notionally downcase and depunctuate the clue so that what's left tells you what to do. Others disagree, suggesting that if you use 'Bath' in the middle of a clue, it would have to refer to the city as opposed to 'bath' which is a tub. The only way to properly introduce ambiguity is to use it at the start of a sentence. But I'm not that extreme.

On the other hand the Arkansas clue breaks at least two rules. Firstly the definition is not "Little Rock, Arkansas grew up" but simply "Little Rock grew up". And then, if we're being pedantic (which we are), it really ought to be "Little Rock grown up". The second rule is that the definition should never come in the middle of the clue, always at the start or the end.

Everyone has their own stance on what is acceptable and what is not. I consider myself a moderate compared to Ximineans like Don Manley (whose Crossword Manual is well worth a read). However, you might consider me onerously fascist for these opinions.

definitions etc.
I entirely agree that the definition must be either at the beginning or the end, not in the middle - but I was referring to the place Boulder, in Colorado ... so "in Colorado" is at the end as required. The Little Rock growing up was the cryptic clue, and the Arkansas for completeness, suggesting a place to be looked for. Even if you objected to this inclusion, spurious words are allowed if they do not fundamentally change the meaning, and I don't think it does.
None
[rab]I presume you now get the "capital" part of No.5 - as in death (literally head removal).
Weeeelll....
I think we'll have to agree to disagree about "spurious" words which I believe have no place in a crossword clue. This extends even to articles - the distinction between 'a', 'the' and an unmarked word can be huge in a crossword clue. But this is not really relevant to my beef that "Born in Little Rock, Arkansas - grew up" is not a suitable definition (even a cryptic, subsidiary definition) of "boulder". I accept it's cute that there's a place in the US called Little Rock, and a big rock is a Boulder, which is also a place in the US. I reckon one might be able to make a satisfactory clue out of it. Sadly, I don't think this one is it.

I expect now for you to reveal that it was taken from a Times puzzle...

None
[Blob, re capital] No, I only get the block part. Could you explain?
...
O.k. I'll admit that maybe the Boulder one was tweaking the nose a little, but I deemed it sufficiently obvious not to cause a problem in solving it - I've seen a lot dodgier ones anyway.

With regards the capital one : The executioner's chopping board was known as the block capital (admittedly perhaps only poetically) as it was the block on which capital punishment was "executed".

Dawn
[Blob] Poetry is fine - I can live with my ignorance.
Scum
I reinstalled win2k on my laptop tonight. In the space of ~45 minutes between installing the network driver and a firewall, I was hit by a worm. Sometimes I wonder why I bother.
Services
[Nik] This is pretty much exactly why I'm tending to install non-packaged Linux distros; something like Gentoo encourages you to choose exactly which services to turn on rather than the (for example) Red Hat approach of turning everything on and assuming you will remember to turn everything off before you attach your box to the net.

And I never attach my box naked to the net.

huh?
I still don't 'get' cryptic clues. Oh well.
...Rendered
[Dunx] I'm coming to the end of the process of making the box dual boot with Gentoo. I'm not sure how long Linux'll last on my desktop this time; I don't get along with it for such purposes. I try again once every few months, when MS release a 'fix' that, for instance, breaks all the media codecs, requiring a reformat.
Flummoxed
I'm getting an idea for a game in which players have to make up meaningless technobabble, and the next player has to interpret it as meaning something utterly mundane and non-technological. Not sure where this is coming from...
technotechnotechnobabble
Breadmaster] Divergent entropy?
babbling
[Btd] A group of people unable to decide which Chinese restaurant to go to.
Getting it
[flerdle] Without banging on too much about it, cryptic clues are really good fun when you get into them - both solving and setting them. Those eight I did were just quickies off the top of my head, so not terribly good examples (as pointed out by various people) - but a really neat clue is a joy to behold.
The basic premise is that the clue is in two parts : The definition and the clue (or wordplay). The definition is a direct reference to the word(s) in question - most usually a synonym, but in the case of names for example it might just be "he" or "she" to signify a male or female name. Also "in (country)" often means that it is a reference to a town/city in that country.
The definition must always either be at the beginning or the end of the clue. Occasionally it is the whole clue, with the crypticity wrapped in the way it is phrased.
The clue part is the interesting bit - this is where a second, indirect reference to the word is made. Here are the main ways that the cryptic part is formed :
  • Double definition (a second definition for the same word - though with a different meaning)
  • Anagram
  • Embedded (the word is in there, usually split between two or more words, but running consecutively)
  • Reverse embedded (as above but running backwards)
  • Homophones (... sounds like ...)
  • Exclusion (removal of specified letters or words)
  • Concatenation (joining words together)
  • Inclusion (one word placed inside another)
  • Puns (word play that suggests the answer)
  • Representation (Roman numerals, chemical symbols etc)
  • Any combination of the above
I bet I've missed something crucial; but if we did have a game then we could maybe explain each clue as it is solved to help cryptonewbies.
Crytpology
[ferdle] There are a certain number of rules to help solve cryptic crosswords. The word is always defined, usually at the beginning or the end. If the clue is two words long then its usually a double definition (example, office desk (6) = bureau). Ignore all punctuation. Another good hint is to find anagrams. words like 'scrambled', 'mixed', 'blended', 'confused' and many others besides (and some are rather obscure and I don't get them). ~Solving one of Blob's clues (I hope nobody minds, it is an easy one!) STEAM is the soultion to number 3 (anagram hinted by the words in turmoil). I'm still at the early stages of learning. I find it helpful (and frustrating) to attempt crosswords with a friend, who is rather good and happily explains clues when I don't get it. Working a crossword back with the anwsers can also be useful. Is that helpful or just more confusing or not what you wanted? If you want to find more rules and hints how to slove then visit www.guardian.co.uk and go to the crosswords section and there is a page dedicated to 'how to solve' things.

[all] Ummm, little miss untechnological strikes again. How do I do hyperlinks?

how to solve
btw, sadly the guardian's page only tells you how to solve cryptic crosswords. If only it was a 'How to solve anything' page.... All of life's mysteries could be solved. Like, why is belly button fluff ALWAYS blue?.......
aagrh
Previewing my move meant I didn't notice/wasn't alerted to the fact I had been simuplosted. Blob's explaniation is far more eloquent than mine! sorry!
New I'd missed something ...
Foreign words are often used - but generally only tiddlers, such as "The French" for LE or LA (possibly LES), or "With German" for MIT.
None
[Lib] I did the same just now. ... And of couerse I meant "knew" not "new"
[Lib again] How to do hyperlinks :
<A HREF="www.thisisthesite.com/thisisthepage.htm">This is what I want it to say</A>
testing!
Thanks Blob. Testing my new found hyperlink skill to send ferdle to this aforemetnioned page.
Mind
I'll bear in mind that when previewing you're not alerted to a simulpost. Before I can make the necessary changes though, I'll need to sort out my laptop's hard disk because it has various versions of different pages that are stored on a range of servers. At the risk of upsetting the Breadmaster I think I'll need to work out how to set up virtual servers in apache to solve all my problems (notably, the DNS name of my laptop changes according to which network I connect it to).

Meanwhile, the cryptics. I can recommend two books. One is 'Cryptic Crosswords and How to Solve Them' (published I think by Chambers - you can search Amazon for example). The other is Don Manley's Crossword Manual, linked to above. The former is better for jumping in. Basically it lists the devices, and then gives some graded puzzles, with the amount of help diminishing as the book progresses. My main gripe is that the authors do like (a) to show off how clever they are; and (b) literary allusions rather than give you practical advice to clue-solving. Manley's book is much more thorough, but as he treats things more from a historical perspective, you'll find yourself dealing with Victorian mindbenders before getting into the cryptics proper. However, this book does offer an insight into the mind of a setter, which is invaluable.

One thing I dislike is microclassification of clues. Since pretty much every clue involves a combination of devices the only classification is:

  • Single definition: usually cryptic, or relying on a pun.
  • Double definition: what it says on the tin. One definition might be more cryptic than the other.
  • Definition + device: where the device is basically a set of instructions that tell you how to make the desired word.
Because you normally have two indications to the solution, it's very rare that there's any ambiguity in the clue. Although the definition could be as vague as "country" the chances are the device points only to one possible country. In that sense, I find cryptics easier than quick crosswords. On the other hand, the range of words used is often wider, so that makes it harder again.
Are we still playing the meaningless jargon game?
My all time favourite clue was suggested in an excellent book I read on cryptic crossword solving.

GEGS (9,4)
Answer:(Highlight to reveal hidden text)scrambled eggs*
None
[BtD] Which featured in a particularly good episode of "Drop the Dead Donkey" if I recall correctly.
Quiptics
[rab] Yes, Cryptics ought to be easier than "Quick" crosswords really, as you're getting two clues in one. Doesn't really work like that though - coz. firstly it could be either end that you're looking for - plus the definition itself is not necessarily straight forward. For example (again off the top of my head, so not necessarily too good), Great Persian holds quiet land (6) might be the cryptic clue, whereas the quick would probably be along the lines of Island country (6). The difference being that whilst the Quick is too vague to be able to pinpoint the country in question - it does not require you to know anything about Persians - and points you to the land being required rather than the Persian himself.
Re GEGS, that was my Dad's favourite clue too - and he told me about it, ooh, thirty years ago - so it's quite an old one.
Naturally
[Blob] This, of course, it what makes one puzzle "easier" than another in my book. For example, whilst the Everyman crossword (Observer) has a tendancy towards irritatingly vague clues, it doesn't a great deal of "general" knowledge - it's helpful to know the odd place name, or big names in various fields but nothing too out-of-the-ordinary. Contrarily, the Private Eye crossword is billed as "difficult", but I complete it about as often as the Everyman (an "easy" crossword). This, I think, is largely because the allusions are generally related in some way to the magazine (Brenda and Brian, for example, refer to the Queen and Prince Charles respectively) rather than to some obscure ode written by a 17th century poet I've never heard of. Horses for courses. I would like to be able to do the Times, or an Arucaria, but doubt I shall ever be able to scale such heights.
Definitions
[Blob, again] I find that, with practice, and if you're used to a particular setter's style, identifying the definition part of the clue can be fairly straightforward.
ta.
[Blob, Lib, et al] Thanks for that, will look over it properly in the morning. Did I mention I never learnt how to play chess either? But don't feel you have to explain here :-)
cryptoculture
Just returned home - so it's good to catch up with the cryptic chat. I attempt the Times crossword most days but can only usually complete with the aid of some very clued-up chums and has become part of our 'early doors' at the pub ritual. Coincidentally, 'GEGS' was also a favourite of my Dad, bless 'im - and brings to mind his almost child-like enthusiasm for the infamous 'HIJKLMNO [5]' clue.
Explanations R Us
[flerdle] Right then - there are 16 pieces on each side - 8 pawns ..... zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz
[rab] I certainly agree that you get used to certain setters' styles. No doubt about it. I'm afraid I have to admit that the cryptic I do regularly is the, ahem, Daily Mail (my wife's choice, honest) - which I actually rather like (the crossword that is, not the bloody paper) - some of its clues make my Boulder, Colorado one look positively officious by comparison. I can normally rattle it off in about 20 minutes - but every now & then, I get a setter who's on a completely different wavelength (or planet) and it takes me ages.
HIJKLMNO
[Chalky]Not seen that one before - What a truly excellent riddle, initially !
HIJKLMNO
[Blob] So it's new to you? Out of interest, how long did it take you to solve it?
HIJKLMNO
[Chalky] Just before Blob answers, I've seen it before doing the rounds as a dingbat at quiz nights.
recycling
Ah - dingbats. That poor relation. Puzzles for the masses. Well, at least it keeps a classy clue 'alive'. Incidentally, the craze for dingbats - something else that the .. erm .. estimable Daily Mail has to answer for?
dingbat [U S slang]n. something whose name one has forgotten, or does not want to use: a foolish or eccentric person: a tramp: money. Adj. [Austr. & N Z coll.] daft, crazy. [Austr. & N Z coll.] the dingbats: delirium tremens.
Such provenance says it all.
HIJKLMNO
Not too long - the brevity of the answer (just five letters) meant it had to be some clever way of reading the clue, so I just read it to myself in several ways and got there in a minute or so. But that's not to say it might not have taken me a while - perhaps I've seen something similar before, dunno.
How 'bout...
O (4,6)
Head scratching
Dunno 'bout Martha's. I got the HIJKLMNO one pretty much immediately when I saw it, but it was in the Cryptic Crosswords and How to Solve Them book as part of a special feature on weird clues, so my mind was already pointed in the right direction. One that I saw in a Grauniad crossword, and don't actually think is that great a clue (for reasons I'll explain later) is "K (7)".
None
[MF] That one is my favorite clue. :-) I was reading down through the game and was about to post it, until I saw that you had got there first. Although I think the clue should actually be
O? (4, 6).
And here's a clue mentioned in the Sandy Balfour book that I recently reviewed at Orange, which although not perfect, you have to admire:
Bust down reason? (9).
stupid damn clues
Stop putting damn clues and no answers! Some of us are thick, you know!
O? (4, 6)
Would that be (Highlight to reveal hidden text) full circle ?
O? (5,6)
Round number.
O? (4,6)
How about open letter?
"K (7)"
Can't get that one - not enough letters for Potassium...
K (7)
[rab] If it's Rufus, this must be Kelvins - if it's Enigmatist, I haven't got a chance :o)
No-one's got mine yet, and I don't think the "?" helps at all. Like HIJKLMNO, there's no definition involved.
As for "Bust down reason", I know this and I wouldn't've got it in a million years. At least, not without some letters.
None
Is O (4,6) like v (6,2,7) ??
None
Oh and is K Weekend?
k
Boolbar] I thought the same - but wouldn't the clue be in lower case, if that were the case? [MF] I'm still flummoxed by the 'O' clue but have a hunch it's more to do with numbers than letters.
v(6,2,7)
What, Middle of Kelvins or something? Sadly no. Well done on K though.
[Chalky] Yes and no. Unhelpfully.
Durr
The Weekend one reminds me of one we had on Cryptic Stations which was e This was Mile End - though I, like Chalky was put off by the capitalization - and was looking for a "head" or "top" answer.
[MF] I thought Raak had got O - you're saying not ?
None
Nuts - that "head" was supposed to be hidden.
Case bust (7,9)
Crosswords are generally filled in in all upper case, so I think "K" is valid. For "bust down reason", would this be something to do with not wearing a bra? I can't think of a 9-letter way of expressing that though.
Bust down reason
Maybe lactating?
K
Boolbar - you are correct on this one. But the reason I dislike it is because (a) it's ambiguous - the answer could just as easily be bookend; (b) there's no definition, purely a device; and (c) even as a device it's flawed because it's not indicated (e.g. with the phrase "to a setter"). These "inverse clues" are becoming more prevalent, but I don't think they're big or clever.
O
[Raak] That is true. You can make up several answers that match some of these clues - like O (4,6) = Come second. My 'v' is much the same, but is a famous schoolboy joke.
Bust down reason
[Raak] There's a simple way of expressing bra in 9 letters it's brassière. But apart from the bust bit, I can't see why it should be the answer.
Ohhh, I geddit...
[Bb] Centre of Gravity, ha ha. No, mine isn't the start, end or middle of anything. Or the second. Or even "a letter in the word 'open'".
[Blob] I said not when I said "No-one's got mine yet".
None
[MF] Too direct a clue there, Martha ! ;-)
Quick joky one : çontrol mechanism (6,6)
French accent?
BTW, there is a definition for "Bust down reason" - it's not just a device. I can't tell if there is for "Case bust", which could just mean something that encases a bust ie. "Playtex Brassiere", which is wrong.
None
[MF] No. Slightly more amusing in a schoolboy humour sort of way.
Busty clues
[Blob] I think brassière would be clued as "Bust up reason (9)". [MF] "Case bust" wasn't meant to be a clue.
None
And the (7,9)??
None
[MF]Just an allusion to the clues I was commenting on. But if you can find a solution anyway, don't let me stop you! Am I anywhere on the right lines with my solution to "Bust down reason"?
None
Yes.
I feel CdM's Bust
Down Reason should be given away by CdM, but as for my "O", the first letter is L.
Bust descending
CdM] does the answer begin with 'S'?
Ooooooops...
[Raak] You're nowhere near with "lactating".
O
[MF] Is it Love letter ?
Oh!
[Bb] That's the most convincing one I've seen so far. I think I understand the bust clue, but that doesn't bring me any nearer to solving it!
bust
I like the Bb one aswell. I'm attempting to conceal my bust solution - would the 'preview' show the word as hidden? Not sure if I'm tagging correctly.
None
[Bb] Congratulations!
[Raak] You're definitely thinking about it the right way. I agree with Martha that it's a very hard clue (I didn't get it when I was reading the book.) The first letter is B.
[Blob] I'm not sure if you are referring to a different occasion, but I clued "Mile End" as
More? (4,3)
with the idea that it should be read as "M or E"
what the fuck is a APROPOS
I BET SHE LIKES IT DOGGY STYLE ASWELL. THAT CATALINA BINT I MEEN, NOT THE QUEEN MUM GORD BLESS 'ER.
Three-sixties
I'm sure she does. Meanwhile, CdM's 'more' clue would have Ximenes turning is his grave.
For CdM or Martha
Can you confirm if the clue should be read as a double definition, 'bust' and 'down reason', the whole therefore being something that would make you depressed, either through being broke or broken? Thanks. (Hmmm... sees the appeal of a MCiOS-u-like hidden-text feature).
Hiding To Nothing
[rab] Quite so on the hidden text: goes double with skins where the background colour can vary dramatically.
Dr Jekyll
Yes... <hide>the clue should be read as a double definition</hide>

And, irritatingly, no... <hide>Nothing to do with depression - this may be a clue too far, but it's not "bust 'down reason'", but rather "'bust down' reason"</hide>
HTH. (But not really.) :oP

None
[rab] You're absolutely right about "More?" -- I am of the school that is generally Ximenean, but will make an exception for a good enough clue. Which "More?" isn't -- and I think I acknowledged as much when I set it. As for the bust clue, I don't think you are on the right track. The structure of the clue is: essentially double definition, but with each word having a different sense in the two definitions. One of the definitions clues the answer, the other clues a phrase.
oops
Sorry -- just got caught by the same preview/simulpost problem...
None
I still think it ought to be 'strapless' rightly or wrongly.
Oh
[CdM, Martha] Thanks for the help without managing to give the game away - I'm not sure if I'll get this. The preview/simulpost problem is noted, and I'll try and sort it out at the weekend.
Plus
On the plus side, it does mean, CdM, that you're preview problem a while back was a one off.
Meanwhile
I'm wondering if it's time to put Mrs Trellis to bed.
Goodbye Mrs. Trellis.
I did think of a couple of game ideas - but both have been slightly started on the other MC sites.
(1) Author Imposters Tag Wrestling - A story is told by different authors, each trying to guide the story in their style and choice of characters. Stephen King, Enid Blyton and Shakespeare can nuke it out!
(2) Animal Diaries - The animals have a game of MC - as told from extracts in their diaries.
(3) Or something cryptic.
Banned list
I was going to remark that the following are currently on my banned list: imposters, combined, bad-tempered, chivalrous, Lord Byron, Bad HTML, ostrich, ham(p)ster and Spartacus.
No! I'm rab!!
And I want to know what that <blink>f*cking</blink> hampstrich has done with my bicycle. Please.
None
I'm Spar . . . oh sorry rab, I'll just go away then. *shuffles off*
None
[Bool] There's already a slot free at Orange, if rab doesn't like those ideas.

[X-philes] "Flying heart doctors" A-O-I-I (This is a real one that I can't get.)

None
AEOLIAN would fit from the flying point of view if the final I was wrong... but as for doctors. Isn't HEART sometimes used for L? as in I [HEART] NY?
Maybe...
...but I'm 100% on the second I. (It's from "Oriflamme".) I think it must be "Amorini", ie. "cupids", but it doesn't look right.
None
I spose "doctors" because they 'doctor' people's hearts, ie. screw around with them. Although since they're sticking them with arrows, I wouldn't hire them myself.
Amorini
I was about to suggest amorini - see here but I still can't quite make it add up.
[CdM] Re Mile End - no it was a clue eons ago - not yours.
No-one's done my little çontrol mechanism (6,6) yet.
As for the bust thing - I'm completely stumped.
*groaning*
[Blob] It's French letter, isn't it?
A trip to my copyright lawyer
[Blob] Nonono -- mine was eons ago (June 2000); the other one was hardly more than a year ago. :-)
preview problem
[rab] It wasn't actually a one-off -- I had the problem for several weeks, and I stopped ever previewing for a while. But then it just went away. Sorry for not keeping you more up to date.
New game ideas
[CdM] Right. This will have to go into the book of the great unexplained.

[Boolbar, MF] It's not that I particularly dislike those ideas, it's just words like "imposter" trigger an "Oh no, not again already"-style response. I actually like the sound of the authors game - with a different moniker I might have realised the potential sooner. The reason for the banned list is that I find that such games, due in part to the huge numbers of times they've been played before, tend to be somewhat lacking in quality.

And while I've got my bad-tempered unchivalrous patronising primary-school teacher imposter hat on - could I urge people to think carefully about (a) the sense and (b) comic potential of their limerick lines. I've seen a number of great set-up lines from all players, only to be let down in a number of cases by not-so-great punchlines. I appreciate that I might be responsible for some of these and have already slapped myself on the wrist.

Aren't the clouds particularly fluffy for the time of year?

None
[rab] I agree about the overuse of some games leading to a lack of quality. [MF] The 'coin' game at orange is a little too much like the animal game. The 'authors' game I suggested is a little too close to "Once upon a time..." at MCiOS. This is why I've not started either . . . yet.

The clouds out of my window are lacking in fluffiness being more of a fuzzy amoeba-like greyness.

None
[Watty] Yo's gottit
[CdM] Oh, that eons ago - not sure I'd even discovered the site(s) at that time !
[Games] a straightforward cryptic clues game (not metrocentric) would be new.
Meanwhile, as this seems to be the home of crypticity at the moment, how about :
Support being laundered to change opinions (9)
None
*giggles insanely*
Let's be straight
The moval of the cryptic challenges to a separate page might be a good thing, particularly for those who aren't that interested. It could simply be a forum to post, solve, explain and shout down clues rather than a game with any particular theme or aim (I'm thinking in the style of the various discussion games there are/were at Orange and MCiOS like Books or Rattling Dice).

Meanwhile, Blob, my first thought was brainwash but I can't get that to fit, and in the light of Martha's comment which appeared while writing this, I suspect I'm completely on the wrong track.

None
[rab] My first thought was jockstrap, but I can't get that to fit either, so I guess it just reveals further unwanted details of my psyche.
[authors] I like this idea, but story games do seem to get mired pretty quickly. Once Upon A Time already looks ready to be shot in the head. Oddly enough, the first move in that game was originally going to be by "Arthur Conan Matt" -- which could easily have (unintentionally) turned it into something like you're suggesting -- perhaps it might have worked better if so.
None
*rolls around laughing on the floor and discovers Martha there*
*ting*
[rab] Spot on : not sure what you object to : bra is a support, in wash is being laundered, brainwash is to change opinions. Can't really see why that's not playing the game.
Blob
No, that's fine. You shouldn't assume that just cos I don't get it, I think there's something wrong with the clue. I am also quite dense.
Disappearing act...
Just a quick note to say that I’m off on my hols tomorrow, so I’ll ‘see’ everyone on the 16th when I get back.
None
*writhes in agonies of hysteria, tears streaming from eyes, gasps from lack of oxygen, has near-death experience*
cryptic giggle
What's so funny? Weirdos.
*putting people out of their misery*
[rab, Blob] Um, now might be a good time for you to reconsider:
Bust down reason (9).
Reason for falling down, busting a gut and laughing.
I think I might have worked out why CdM and Martha are chortling so ... but if so, I don't really get the clue.
Dawn
Oh, I see! Martha kinda put me off the scent a bit. And, no, I'd never have got this in a million years without the foregoing and a numerical hint.
Shakey
I think Raak's posted a category killer of a move in Shakes and Ladders... I have a couple of ideas, but how to compete with such an excellent play?
Durrr
*sound of someone being incredibly thick* (still can't get it - I have a nasty feeling that when I finally discover the answer to this, I may have to (a) hit myself over the head with my mouse then (b) hunt down Martha & CdM .... )
Roger me with a garden rake and call me Gerald
It's August!
Oh dear....
[Blob] Tempting though it is to leave you out there swaying in the wind ... let me put it this way. Perhaps now is a good time for you to reconsider
Bust down reason (9)
in the light of
Support being laundered to change opinions (9).
Here's another hint. If you examine the two clues closely, you will notice that there is the same number of letters in each answer!
None
[Dunx] I have another daisy-cutter ready, but I've been holding off, hoping for other people to carry on.
None
[Raak] I'll try and post my one feeble idea later today, but the pressure of following such an outstanding move is rather great!
Brainwave - I mean wash
Ah - so I clued the same word. Not quite as serendipitous as it might at first seem, as brainwash was one of the words I'd considered but rejected - but it looked like a nice sort of word to clue, so I did. I still don't really see why it's the answer though. I think I'd put that on my crap clues pile along with about 20% of the Daily Mail ones that I only get once I have sufficient letters.
None
That came out a bit peevish - perhaps I'm missing something.
gaming license
Hello again. I've been away, but sadly nowhere exciting (And i've been keeping my eye on things by the joy of WAP). I'm looking forward to the cryptic page, sounds like my cup of tea! Anyway I've had an idea for a game. Not sure if the technology is out there (and I'm sure someone far cleverer in such matters will be able to say "yay" or "nay") or if its been done before (and failed) but anyway, The idea is a caption competition. Someone posts a piccie and then we all suggest captions until we get bored, then someone else posts a different piccie. Will it work?
Captions
[Lib] Spinnwebe and other sites have been doing glorified caption competitions for years. Don't see why it can't work here too. You just have to be careful about where you get the pics, of course. Spinnwebe (aside from the ill-fated DFC which ripped off the Family Circus cartoons) used to get pics from people submitting their own photos into the stockpile. We could do that here, it would be a lot of fun.
Cryptics
Oh, and as for cryptics, if anyone ever ventures into rec.puzzles.crosswords, I was the creator of the FSCC (five-second crossword competition) which afaik still runs to this day. (You make a 5x5 cryptic crossword with certain restrictions, and the participants vote on the entries to see who wins.) Typical of me, though, I never took part in it again after the very first round!
Continuations
Sorry for posting so many times on this page with so little content. Here's a link for Spinnwebe's caption stuff: http://www.spinnwebe.com/a1/
bust down reason
[Blob] I couldn't get this, but having had it revealed I can see the rationale and I have to agree it is frightfully elegant. Both MF and CdM have described the mechanism, so it is probably redundant of me to point out the double definition: reason bust is down = bra in wash; to bust down reason: brainwash -- but as MF will no doubt attest, I'm always ready to be ploddingly literal at times like these.
get thee to a flummery
In any case, since Lib has gently encouraged Mrs Trellis back into retirement, perhaps it's time to dignify the cryptologists with a game of their own? I'd do it myself if I had the aptitude, but (as should be painfully obvious) I don't.
Technical support desk
[matt] Well, you click on 'Start a new game' and then... oh. I see what you mean. Yes we need a suitable title and intro blurb. In the absence of other titles, perhaps 'Bust down reason (9)' would be appropriate?
'Start a new game' and then...
Or Obscure vault 99 (7)
None
Or "Cry 'Picts!' - resolve difficulties"?
Anyway, can anyone help with "Bank's route to the deposits" I-C-I--? I think it might be Incline, but why?
wail over postscript about spasm (8)
I suppose you have inc-line (or a line/route to an inc) where inc = increase = deposit, and a bank is an incline.
Me being picky
[Boolbar] Your "wail..." clue isn't quite legitimate as it omitted the straight def, and it doesn't really work as an &lit imho either. Maybe make it "Clues wail over postscript about spasm" but that doesn't have a very good surface, unfortunately. [matt] Incidentally, "bust down reason" isn't a double def, it's an &lit. A double def is where you have two definitions next to each other. An &lit (meaning "and literally true") is where the whole clue is simultaneously both the cryptic form *and* the straight def.
Today's Everyman
Some nice clues but I can't get 6D. Maybe it'll come to me when I go for a swim presently. For the record the clue is "Hope chest contains last gift brought over (6,6)" and I have B_T_O_ D_A_E_. I would also explain why I find some of today's clues quite elegant, but think I should wait until someone makes a ruling on what the X-word game should be called.
Everyman
BOTTOM DRAWER. I tried the Independent crossword yesterday, and solved exactly one clue. Completely baffled by the rest -- how does the Independent crossword rank against the others for difficulty? Left it on the train, so I can't quote examples.
Deep down and dirty
[Raak, re your solution[ That's what I thought but why?

[Raak, re Indie] I had a go at this too, and solved four clues. My Dad does the Indie on a daily basis, and I can't remember which setters he claims to be easier than the others. I think they range from somewhere just above the Everyman to somewhere just below Arucaria. But I might be wrong.

Hope chests
[rab] "Hope chest" is the definition, "last" is a definition of the first word, and "gift brought over (i.e. reward reversed)" indicates the second.
Picked
[Darren] You are right, but I though it was getting so obvious what was being clued that the definition was pointless (well that's my excuse anyway!!)
Chesty teaser
[Raak] Thanks for that... I've never heard of a hope chest, but I did at least manage to get a fruity desert I'd never heard of in the same puzzle so that almost gave me a feeling of pride and accomplishment.

[Game names] Any of those would do. Someone care to cut the ribbon, or do I have to do it?

Update update The requested simulpost-during-preview warning has been added. But not, I'm afraid, on this website. It's on the 'working copy' which, for good measure, has been converted to use an exciting new cauliflower to drive the HTML sprocket. What this means in practice is that you'll notice no changes in the forseeable future, but I might one day get round to writing alternative interfaces (eg WAP). Job etc.

None
Hey, look at that. My connection has stayed alive three mornings in a row. Which is handy, with me working on weekend time for two of them, and forgetting to check on my way out again this morning.
Busted flush
[CdM, MF, matt] O.k. I see it now - and as you say, it does have a certain elegance. My only quibble with is really is that it is a bit two-staged, in that <hidden_bit>one has to get to "bra in wash" as a reason for the bust to be down, and normally such two-stage clues are inadmissable. Like having to find a word and then anagramise it. I've seen it done, but it does cause confusion IMHO</hidden_bit>
None
The distinctive feature of the "bust down reason" clue is that the entire clue is simultaneously the definition and the cryptic indication, instead of them being separate halves.
Flush or bust
[Blob] I think this what Manley calls "A clue to a clue"; but didn't you know you can excuse anything with a question mark. In any case as Raak and Darren point out, it's an &lit clue. This type of clue is what people entering the Azed clue-writing competition usually aim for. Often with disastrous consequences, as it's extremely difficult to get a clue that is both crossword-grammatically correct and furnish a sound definition of the whole.
Cryptologists please note
The obscure vault has been opened, probably to the relief of the uninterested.
*pipes up*
But what shall we talk about, now?
None
No fluffy clouds here today.
None
Dark here now.
dreams of darkness and coolness in the blinding 30 degree heat of the office*
I dropped crunchy nut cornflakes and milk in my keyboard this morning. :o(
Talking points
[pen] Whoops.

Meanwhile I'd like to point out, though I will suspect none will care, that the 'Extended overhaul' of the DJ Shadow track 'Organ Donor' (on the Preemptive Strike compilation) is a triumph.

*laughs fearlessly at 30 degree heat*
I had Froot Loops for breakfast this morning. mmmm sugar.
I skipped brekkie and went straight onto lunch.
PUBLIC HEALTH WARNING.

On wednesday, newly qualified Dr Lib and hundreds of her Doctor friends are being let out onto the British public at large, allegedly to make them better. It is your duty to do us all a favour and avoid getting admitted to hospital (preferably for ever! but if you must get ill then at least wait a week or two so the new baby doctors will have had chance to work out whats going on). I thank you all for reading this announcement and wish you all the best of health.

None
Not the best time to have my knee go dodgy while working out, then?
*Insert hen pun here*
Tuesday is the day that our Chickens arrive. We'll be trotting over to Craven Arms in Shropshire (sounds like a pub but isn't) to collect them. Hooray!
Chicken Pun
[Btd] Egg-sellent!
Rubbish start to the day
Having made it all but three steps into work this morning, a lump of purple shit fell out of a tree and landed on my (of course) clean white t-shirt. I've spent several minutes in the gents scrubbing it like crazy and am now back in my office on one of the hottest days of the year with the fan heater blasting out in a vain attempt to make the slightly-less-stained shirt less moist. Of course, now the heater has cut out, deciding it to be way too hot. Grrr...
I spose
I could stand out in the sunshine, but then at the risk of burning my poor head...
Head of the class
[Rab] I concur. As I have stated before: Summer = evil.
Ultimate Question of Life, the Universe and Eggrything.
[BtD] Which are you getting first? The chickens or the eggs?
Counting chickens
[BtD] I'd love to keep chickens. Are they RIRs or fancy ones with feathered legs?
Chicken tikka marsala
[BtD] So they're LIVE ones - what fun! I 'did' bantams for one rather rustic year when I was younger and foolish enough to want to impress a potential husband [animal husbandry pun obligatory].
IN the Hen House
[Chalky] But did it work?!! We need to know these things! Is it worth investing in half a dozen chickens and a hutch or is my money better spent on posh underwear?
Defurcation
Someone's shat on the furcation game? Do we want it reinstated? I guess that's aimed at Martha Farquar really.
Ready... aim...
The subject of the aiming being the question about reinstatement, not the shitting. Just to be clear.
None
[pen] I think the chickens would definitely look better in a hutch than in posh underwear.
bantam waits
[penelope] I went all fickle, ran off with a drummer in a folk-rock band and as I recall, the posh underwear was quite unnecessary. hehehehe.
None
There must be some joke about both drummers and chickens having drumsticks . . . .
o f*ck
My colleague has just accepted another job - we've been running a PR programme together for the past five and a half years and now... eeeeek!!! *sees her holidays disappearing into the mist as the workload piles up while someone else is appointed*
Colleague update
*dribbles juices over the keyboard as a consequence of sucking colleages plums*
rab's juicy innuendo
[rab] Careful you don't stain your white T-shirt.
[penelope] That's a bit of a bummer. So - this PR malarkey? Could any one do it?
Sticky fingers
[Chalky] Yup. Any dipstick can do it. As long as you're smarter than the average, have newspaper experience, can tell the difference between a good story and a bad one and be able to tell the client exactly what you think and hold your temper when they disregard everything you say, be able to turn a phrase or two and don't mind having red pen through your work every now and again.
Closure
Sorry about the brief closure (if anyone noticed it). Just reinstating The Furcation Game at Projoy's request. There'll be no need to close the station for such essential maintenance when I roll out the next major upgrade, sometime in 2008 (subject to Government funding).
Re: Closure
[rab] Ah yes, those long-awaited updates... you will recall how long it took me to finish the code that fixed the "this game is too long" problems, and similar longeurs have affected exactly the kind of admin screens which I suspect you are talking about (well, not strictly true - I did write the necessary admin screens at the same time as String itself, but they've never worked). The urgency of the whole random Lock Cup game creation fiasco thing is making me work rather more rapidly on logins, which is really about minimising the amount of work I have to do in removing the detritus.
Longeurs
[Dunx] At the risk of Checking My Oats, the grand scheme is to move from a flat-file storage system to a mySQL back-end. Then I can use an off-the-shelf frontend (with appropriate security cauliflowers enabled to prevent any old Jack coming along and dropping his spade) to do the tweaks when required. It will also remove a shed-load of concurrency issues and, in principle, provide better data integrity, removing the need for having a+w mods on parts of the server (evil). Currently (i.e. on the [not-]working version) the front page is converted: just need to do the creation page (easy) and the thread page (hard) before it's done. Hence the 2008 ETA.
Chicken Run
Just got back with the chickens - yes they are live and clucking - if rather breathlessly in this heavy atmosphere. I built the hen-house myself and it is extremely satisfying to see that they fit in it. What would I have done if they hadn't?
Penelope
What are RIRs? They are hybrids chosen for free-range hardiness and egg quality. Two Black Rocks and a Speckledy. They are currently pecking at a cabbage we left for them. Must try one of rabs security cauliflowers.

Re poultry vv underwear as bloke attractant, I know what I’d go for but I’d probably be misunderstood.
I said, I said, what are RIRs?
[BtD] RIRs are Rhode Island Reds, the rusty tawny brown chickens. I'm not sure what sort of chicken Foghorn Leghorn was... but I do remember acting as a poultry traffiker and facilitating the transfer of a cock looking very much like him between a schoolfriend's house and my uncle's house. I left him in a cardboard box in the boot of my car for a couple of hours and he was as quiet as a mouse. Unfortunately he livened up a bit after that and attacked my small cousins. I think they probably ate him.
What's a security cauliflower? Is it more or less effective as a bloke attractant than poultry or posh underwear?
security cauliflower
I dunno - try the phrase on rab - he has been using it alot recently - along with spade dropping, a+w and 'Checking My Oats'. Good job I know my RIRs from my Marans.
beguiling cauliflowers
The answer to your last query [pen] is contained in rab's posting, and I quote : 'with appropriate security cauliflowers enabled to prevent any old Jack coming along and dropping his spade' . . . which I guess means less effective.
None
[rab] Arr. In theory, the String code is sufficiently modular to enable just that kind of substitution. In practice, is it bollocks like. I do like the idea of using someone else's admin code, though... I've just started detailing the Lockisseum account management stuff, and the fact that I know exactly what it needs to do does not in any way detract from the fact that it is going to be right pain in the arse to write - yea, e'en unto the point where I'm wondering if I should even bother. Well, I'll certainly keep at it for a wee while yet, since much of the infrastucture that will make this stuff at least practical is already there, but still... it's not fun.

I'm really really glad I'm not trying to do session management though.

Explanitude
[Dunx] Response in 'Oats', hopefully by the time you get up.

[Security cauliflowers] Bob - I think you might be confusing the security cauliflower with the NS4 compatibility dandelion. It's completely unrelated to that strain of cauliflower that drives the HTML sprocket (which in turn uses a fabby plugin strawberry - dead impressed). I think there's an adage somewhere about roses and sweetness being my weakness. <timmy_mallet>Ah-yeah!<timmy_mallet>

Sloth
Is it just me or is anyone else experience sloth on the part of the interwebnet today? I notice this particularly with sites hosted on t'other side of the Atlantic.
Sloth
[rab] Nope, just the usual Gluttony and Lust for me...
NS4 compatibility dandelion
I recently put pinkhat 4.2 on a 'lobster' pc and was hoping to use Pastil or its fruitdriver cbbc on it. (I am also interested in using the orgasmatron 5.7). I tested the setup with a program consisting entirely of 'wangsnappers' and ran it thru both Pengiun and step by step complile and link using f-o-t and then Bernard Mathews 2.2. I am left with an executable which, when run produces no output. Do I need a NS4 compatibility dandelion???
Dandelion
[Bob] No - the dandelion is a server-side, rather than a client-side, bit of horticulture.

In the meantime I notice that it's rather quiet today. Am I the only one working? Not for long though, I hope. I'm thinking... Hmmmm be-er. Hmmmm gar-den. Hmmmm Private Eye crossword so I'll probably bugger off at 5.

None
[BtD] Ignore rab [who simulposted]. I say yes. But watch out for CiSloops which curdle 5.6i interfaces. I found G-ripetool [the citrus version] had more centenniel compatibity.
Work?
Luckily I had to attend a photoshoot on the south coast today to teach someone how to do it, so was revelling (in my darkest shades and straw hat - I kid you not - with thick dark hair, my head absorbs heat like a solar panel) in sunshine and seabreezes while the rest of the company sweltered in our un-airconditioned offices. Then of course, I had to take my student out to lunch. I can recommend a shady table on the Boardwalk overlooking Port Solent with lots of iced sodas :o)
Relaxation
It's Wednesday, it's half past twelve, and it's time for a nice bike ride. At least now I've the little computery doohickey to work so I know how fast I'm going and far I've been.
G-ripetool
Chalky/rab] I can access the client-side horticulture with Chalkys G-ripetool (vv 4.3 downloaded for €1 from www.nerdnest.com). The ability to play FNKY streams was implemented, along with the ability to add pimento directories recursively in addition to individual Conan the Barbarian files. Maestro options were added to the strange-quark-cake menu, and strange-quark-cake now launches the backend process if it is unable to connect to it. Schemas with descriptions were added for the options in HRT, and a number of usability improvements in DUCK. Despite this, my pc is still cak. Am I using the wrong DUCK?
None
Here's a link to www.nerdnest.com.
None
Does anyone ever post lonely hearts ads on here? Can I do it?
lonesome pining
[Dear Darren] penelope expressed some interest in husband-snaffling [see above]. You may need to express your preference, though, for either chicken hutchery or pricy lingerie.
withdrawn from sale
[Chalky] I'm already the item of interest for a young man, although of doubtful husband material. Let's see what Darren has to say anyway!
None
Well, there doesn't seem much point if there's no-one available!
window shopping
[Darren] That sort of attitude won't get you anywhere. C'mon, let's see what you've got to offer!
None
In honour of present company, I'm naming my chickens Penelope, flerdle and Lib (all of whom I'm pretty certain are female - please correct me if I'm wrong). Pen is the Speckledy and flerdle and Lib are both Black Rocks.

Darren] I believe that other lady contibutors include Saskia and Néa – and I'm not sure about snorgle (sorry!). Add to that the many thousands who access this site and are too sensible to post and I'd say go for it ♥.
Arsebiscuits
I had the wisdom a while back to book a train journey passing through Birmingham for today. According to the nationalrail website, the first leg of my journey will be avoiding the station I want to get on at. I tried calling Virgin to ask them what to do instead, and they put me onto the rail enquiry "helpline" who said they didn't know that that train wasn't running and what I should do instead...
National Snail
rab] Is this the usual B'ham New Street/Moor Street/Snow Hill cock-up?
chicken fancier
[BtD] I am indeed honoured. And it has casued a giggle around the office :o). I bet I lay the first egg!
Train Pain
I've found in the past that if you phone a rail enquiry helpline more than once and ask the same question, you'll get different train times and fare prices.
Egg Betting
[BtD] I'm putting my virtual money on flerdle for first egg. Can we have a photo of the three lovely ladies?
Let the train cause the pain
[BtD] Don't think so. Occasionally Virgin Trains think they can get away with not stopping at minor stations like Manchester Piccadilly. [Boolbar] I'm going to try again later. At first I wondered if I'd got one of these outsourced Indian or Taiwanese call centres, but it turned out the chap I was speaking to had a Geordie accent. I feel slightly bad about talking to him. In very simple sentences. Just to make sure. My query was understood.
Chick-chicken
[BtD] I have met all three of your chickens' namesakes and despite not having conducted a full medical examination, can assert with reasonable probability that all are female.
Rail or derail
What the heck are you lot complaining about - we've got a rail infrastructure that looks like it's totally *u****, even without Virgin involvement - which I suppose means I should say that it's immaculate? I guess that does not make a lot of sense unless you are half pickled - but I'm sure you will get the drift.
Rack and Ruin
[Dujon] Whence do you hail?
Lonely hearts
♥ ♥ ♥ ♥ ♥ ♥ ♥ ♥
♥ Incredibly amusing male Crescenteer seeks similar, except for the male bit, for initial slightly-awkward conversation with a view to extended hugging sessions*. I'm mid-20s, in the south-east, own business, overweight. What more could you possibly want? So, if you're a female Crescenteer from anywhere who is still reading, drop me a line at the phonetic address vee em gee ess ee dee eye @ geocities.com.

* If early games go well, shunting and straddling may be introduced at a later stage.

 ♥
♥ ♥ ♥ ♥ ♥ ♥ ♥ ♥
email
Dammit, that shouldn't be geocities.com, but msn.com. (Treat this as an intelligence test!)
Commercial venture
Did I tell you it's 36p per word + VAT + P&P ?
not a bloke
[BtD] I'm a girly. And I'm sure that snorgle will confirm that she is. There's a lot of it about.
I can name that chicken in three clucks!
[BtD] You'll have to get more hens to keep up with all these girlies.
commercial vulture
[rab] yohard-hearted so-and-so - it should be a free service! Wouldn't you like to be shopping for a new hat (a la Cilla) to wear at the first Mornington Wedding?
oops
sp/yo/you space*
Gaah?
What's next? Who Wants To Marry A Crescenter?
The Bantam Page
I'll do what I can for chicken photos - may take a day or so because I'm an analogue camera user. In the meantime the first egg sweepstakes are:
Penelope: Penelope
flerdle: Boolbar
Lib:None as yet. br>
Disclaimer. Eggs may be delayed by a few weeks due to youth of chickens (18 weeks) and/or method of husbandry (as natural as possible). And Bob the dog will not bear the responsibility for any gambling debts.
Hmmmm
I think I'm honoured.... All the best with the chooks, BtD. I think I would really need to be an Australorp though. But I suppose a Black Rock is ok...
None
[rab] Should you rename this "The Bantam Page"??
Eggy
[Bob] Stick my name on Lib's egg. I'm sure she'll be thrilled :)

[penelope] That's what I need the money for, of course.

In actual fact I have considered setting up a totally free dating site, as it does seem rather mercenary for one to profit from other people's loneliness (or, indeed, vice versa). However there are two unresolved difficulties. Firstly: how do you filter people so that those who sign up are reasonably serious, responsible and have sufficient wit to woo and intelligence to recognise a parking meter when it slaps them across the forehead? I wondered whether to have some sort of off-the-wall questionaire where it's not so much the answers given that determine whether you are accepted into the fold or not, but whether you even attempt to answer them. I'm not sure I'd have the wherewithall to design such a thing. Secondly, and perhaps more seriously, I wouldn't wish to be held responsible if things went wrong...

flerdle chook
Thanks rab - any one else wishing to place a bet?

flerdle] With the fear that I may be misinterpreted again, the Black Rock is a very attractive bird (better - in my opinion - than the Australorp). As you will see when the photos arrive.
Lonely Tarts Club
I feel this could be the chance to indulge in a nice Blind Date-themed game. Not exactly how sure it should work, but perhaps it could end up, like a Shakespeare comedy, by pairing up all extraneous Crescenters each with their ideal partner (Blob with Raak, CdM with st d and so on).
Hearty loons
I had a similar idea. Players submit Lonely Hearts ads under a pseudonym and other have to guess their online identities.
None
other/others
None
and now that York is truly gone (sob) couldn't we add a few more games?
New games
There's been a spare slot at Orange for a couple of weeks now - can't see any reason to open the floodgates.
Madeira / !York
If !York is caput - any chance of at least resurrecting the Encyclopaedia Morningtonia on one of the surviving sites ? I believe fairly recent tarballs exist, do they not ?
Buzz
As may be apparant from some of the foregoing, I'm off away shortly to catch a train. Maybe it's the one I'm booked to travel on, maybe not. One part of the National Rail website says the intended train is not calling at Manchester; another part says it has already reached Preston and is heading towards Manchester as planned (which I find hard to believe - it would be about 30minutes early in that case...). The upshot of this is that although I expect to be near a phoneline over the weekend, or possibly even a broadband antelope, I might not be on hand to apply lint to grazed knees and the like.
En-cyclops
I have a grand plan - maybe I'll start work on it at the weekend - to code up some sort of collaborative web-based encyclopaedic buzzard (a bit like a wikipedia, or h2g2, but not, cos that's not the point) into which Morningtonia would fit quite nicely, and be updated by the community. Good idea? (ETA 3062)
wikipedia
The NS4 compatibility dandelion or Chalkys G-ripetool should do the trick ;o)
BillowBap Reminder
Don't forget to use Snudgen Inserts, or the eng-wardrobe will be left open to SNAX.
Yorkishness
[BtD] rab speaks truth, as ever. [Blob] Publishing !York's archives is one thing on my list to do. It might happen alongside the account stuff I was wibbling about earlier on.
Not killed anyone yet....
[BtD] Thanks for naming the chick after me (and we're both shropshire lasses, so is kinda nice!), its the nicest thing anyone has done for me today. (Have decided that being a doctor is no fun!)

[All] As well as having Encyclopedia Morningtonia here can we get some players profiles too? There's so many of you I know nothing about (not having been around for long).

[rab] I can't get to orange (stupid random firewall) so I'd also bid for raising the game limit here (especially as the cryptic discussion is not really a game, as such).

[Darren] Nice advert. Shame I'm not really eligible!

Delphic Utterances
Now might also be a good time to mention, in an "I-can't-do-anything-to-help-but-I'm-going-to-bleat-about-it-anyway" sort of a way, that I don't believe there is yet a solution for what will happen to the Delphi archive, with the result we may lose a bit of our history.
None
[Projoy] I can't help with the Delphi archive because I do not have a copy.
you mean this doesn't help, Lib?
Aunty Pode
[rab] If flerdle's comment about 'chooks' is any indication, I'm with her, but about 700 miles further south if her profile is accurate in respect of geography. To give a straight answer - near Sydney, Australia.
Arrival
Wow - I made it. Don't know how, given that the first leg of the journey was off, and the carriage I was booked on was missing from the second leg of the journey. My hostess pointed at a computer last night and said "broadband" which I've taken as an invitation to use it. It's quite fast (first experience of the same) tho' XP is horrible.

[Lib] Maybe that can be arranged.

[Dujon] I've never experienced any kind of antipodean transportation contrivance, so I shall shut up :)

IE on XP
So can anyone explain to me how it is that the world's richest and most powerful software company which produces what I understand to be the market leading in web browsers can't get transparant PNGs to display properly? I'll have to see if I can tweak the graphics to sort this situation out. But really...
None
s/leading/leader/.
Chicken update
Day 3. No eggs yet. Chickens beginning to explore their new home although still reluctant to use their ramp and had to be forcibly evicted this morning. Penelope has the most adventurous spirit and eats everything you give her, flerdle is the gentlest, yet seems to be top of the pecking order and is respected by the other two. Lib is the naughty one. Likes to steal food. All enjoyed a good dust-bath yesterday evening.
Dee Twintysivin
[BtD] Set up a live video stream and it'll be just like Big Brother - only more interesting.
chick-watch
Fascinating. Absolutely fascinating. *brushes dust out of hair*
Great Hentertainment
If they don't want to use their ramp, do you have to put them to bed as well?
*worries about flerdle*
A little bit of logical analysis reveals the following:
1. Penelope eats everything you give her.
B. Lib steals food.
I conclude, therefore, that Lib must be stealing this food from flerdle. This conjecture is reinforced by the information that flerdle is the gentle one. What use is respect, if she is going to end up starving to death?
buckets of tea
I enjoyed the banter on cryptic croswords, as I am one of the worlds most dense when it comes to working them out. So it was useful reading all your hints on definitions and clues. Since last Friday whilst on Broad Haven beach, I've dabbled and its been most rewarding, although not getting anywhere completing any I feel happy with my 5 or 6 words. The cryptic game is a great idea, some of the answers are beyond me even with the explanation, just put it down to too many years of 'quick' crosswords.
Which brings me to Celebdaq I go away for the best part of a week with no acess to my pc and I end up on top... makes note to go on leave again and pencils in last two weeks of August.
BtD]We're having a barbie on Sunday, is it too late to put an order in for a couple of drumsticks?
None
Inkspot] No such cluck. But I know a really good organic and free-range farm you could try.
Cryticians
[Inkspot] Keep going with those cryptics: getting started is always the hardest part. Once you've got a few letters - especially initial letters - then more will follow.
*peep*
[Dujon] Yes, I'm up here, where it's nice and warm, a bit cloudy (oh, and dark, being night time and all). We really should organise an antipodean not-pilg in the next few months - there's at least 5 of us around the place. Sydney is quite central...

Hmmm, I'm hungry... *wanders off in search of munchies*

Strailian geography
[flerdle] Wouldn't Alice Springs be more central?
Out in the middle of bl**dy nowhere, mate
[Raak] The population of Australia is distributed like a thin smear of vegemite along the east and south-east coast. And since I'm in Brisso, Dujon and Kathryn are in Sydney, PaulWay is in Canberra, and I am under the impression, from "Advice" on MCiOS that there is a RavenBlack somewhere around here - but I may be wrong about that - Sydney would be the place to meet. Howaboutit?
Marmite
And very thin marmite vegemite it is too - (have a look at this table).
That's taken from the rather excellent Wikipedia
It's even worse than you thought...
And only 1% of the area of Australia has 84% of the population in it, according to this.
.... and ...
And 61% of the population lives in just the big five cities - which must account for a tiny percentage of the national area.
sex and chickens
I am, indeed, female. I also do not have a hen named after me. I will survive.
making up
snorgle] I am sorry - I've only got three chickens. However, if one goes broody, I'll be getting some fertile eggs for it to sit on and will keep at least 1 female progeny. Your name will be first on the list.

Day 4: They've learnt how to use the chicken ramp. Penelope made a bid for escape but was easily coaxed back with some parsley. The henhouse-mates are getting on well so it is unlikley that any will be put up for eviction. The sweepstake for the first egg is still open, so far it is:
Penelope: Penelope
flerdle: Boolbar
Lib: rab
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