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AVMA Take 2
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Yes, it's another round of that classic guessing game - Animal, Vegetable, Mineral, Abstract [or any combination thereof]. This effort - '03/'04 should address any queries, but then again, may just serve to confuse and baffle which some might say is the point of the game. Patience, integrity and a decent search engine may be useful ....
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Is it unique?
[Rosie] Thanks! Would've been nice to know when I went there every few weeks a few years ago... but at least that proves I could have been seen there, I guess
[Tuj] Not unique.
Vegetable wood?
[Rosie] Not wood.
Edible?
[CdM} Yes, edible.
Commonly eaten?
[CdM] Commonly eaten.
Eaten raw?
[Software] Not eaten raw.
A confectionary item of some sort?
[jim] I don't think this is classed as confectionary. Or confectionery.
Does it taste sweet?
[CdM re: gorilla] "the recipient will simply love it to pieces." Are they using "love" as a euphemism for "smash"?
A dish?
(I mean as in 'Fish and Chips', not as in a nice piece of Samian Ware)
[Projoy] * a ripple of polite applause* It is sweet.
[INJ] Not a dish.
Honey?
A raspberry ripple of polite applause?
[jim] Not honey (being neither cooked, nor -- apart from the occasional stray bee leg -- animal).
[CdM] Not a raspberry ripple.
Is suet involved?
[INJ] As near as I can judge from Google, this does not generally contain suet.
Jelly on a plate?
[FGZ*] Not jelly on a plate.
Can it be bought in a supermarket as a single item?
[Rosie] That sounds like two questions. Can it be bought in a supermarket? Yes. Does one buy them individually there? No.
Sold ready to eat?
[FGZ*] Ready to eat.
Rice pudding?
[FGZ*] Not rice pudding.
Generally found in the chiller cabinet?
[INJ] Brrrr? No.
Marshmallows?
[Software] Not marshmallows. (I'd class those with confectionery.)
Sweet and sour pork?
(Raak) Wasn't meant to be two questions but whether you could buy a packet of "it" in a supermarket, or anywhere.
Typically sold in a bottle, jar or can?
[Rosie] You can buy a packet of it.
[CdM] ...but not a bottle, jar, or can.
It might be profitable at this point to consider the Abstract part of this.
[Rosie] That was slightly misleading -- you can buy a packet of them.
Involves chocolate in any way? Such as a packet of "Smarties" or "M&Ms" ?
[irach] It can involve chocolate.
A cookie?
Crunchy frog?
[Rosie] Only if it's a crunchy frog cookie, as...
[CdM] ...a cookie it is. nom nom nom.
[Raak] Um, where's the baton? There seems to be just a pile of crumbs here.

This one is MINERAL and VEGETABLE.
Vegetable wood?
Wood? In part, yes.
mineral = metal?
A building?
A garden?
Metal? No.
A building? No.
A garden? No.
Significant amounts of water?
Significant amounts of water? It is going to come down a bit to the definition of "significant", but I think the best answer is No. Despite this, the audience *applauds*.
mineral = stone?
A natural feature?
A desert?
Stone? In large part, Yes
Natural feature? Yes.
Desert? No.
The Grand Canyon?
Grand Canyon? No. (Besides, someone already did that, iirc)
Near the sea?
Near the sea? Yes. *applause*
In Europe?
European? No.
Do rock climbers climb it?
A headland?
The hole in the rock, near Paihia, New Zealand?
Climbing? Yes (parts of it).
Headland? No. *tiny smattering of applause*
Incredibly long-shot guess? No.
A mountain, possibly Everest?
In the Americas?
Is it an island?
Mountain? No.
In the Americas? No.
Island? Yes. *applause*
Rockall?
Long shot.
Rockall? No. (That's in Europe, last I heard)
In Australasia?
Inhabited?
Hawaii?
Java?
Australasian? No.
Inhabited? Yes.
Hawai'i? No.
Java? No.
Has it been in the news recently?
Volcanic?
Bigger than an Arran?
Tristan de Cuhna?
Newsworthy? Not that I am aware of.
Volcanic? No.
Arranometricity? Smaller than an Arran.
Tristan de Cunha? No.
Tropical?
Fernando Po
?
Tropical? Yes.
Fernando Po
? No
.
Isolated, i.e. not part of an archipelago?
Isolated? No.
A British Overseas Territory?
BOT? No.
In the Indian Ocean?
Bikini Atoll?
In the Indian Ocean? As so often happens, seemingly easy questions end up being harder than I expect. But, based on my reading of Wikipedia, the best answer is Yes. Not to be cryptic about it, it is in a body of water with a separate name, but which is usually considered to be part of the Indian Ocean.
Bikini? No.
Bay of Bengal?
Bay of Bengal? No.
Is it an independent country?
South China Sea?
Al Hallaniyah?
One of the Maldives?
Independent country? No.
South China Sea? No. (That's part of the Pacific.)
Al Hallaniyah? No.
One of the Maldives? No.
I'll just clarify one thing: this island is part of an archipelago by the standard definition, which is pretty broad -- that is, it is part of a group of islands. But focusing on well-known archipelagos is unlikely to be helpful. (My first reaction when I read Rosie's archipelago was that this island is not part of an archipelago, and it was only when I checked the definition of the word that I decided that it in fact is.)
In the Arabian Sea?
Réunion?
Part of Africa?
Arabian? No.
Réunion? No.
African? No.
Andaman and Nicobar Islands
Andaman and Nicobar Islands? No (Wikipedia tells me they are in the Bay of Bengal).
Sentosa?
Interestingly, Wikipedia shows the Indian Ocean going as far as the Malay peninsula and therefore including my guess. However that does also mean that several hundred Indonesian islands are also possibles.
Sentosa? No.
My reading of wikipedia is, roughly speaking, that there is one pretty broad definition of ocean, whereby pretty much all salt water is included in one ocean or another. Within these oceans there are then various pieces of water that have their own names -- example, the Bay of Bengal is part of the Indian Ocean. But there is also a narrower definition, in which the oceans are basically all the unnamed left over bits.
In the East Indies?
Excuse me for having 2 goes in a row - but at least it's not a guess at the answer.
That was my understanding as well, but I hadn't really thought about the implications in that part of the world, if you're going to say that you go directly from the Indian to the Pacific ocean.
East Indian? No.
Part of Australia?
Komodo?
Australian? No.
Komodo? No.
Not sure why it is proving so hard to narrow this down, other than the fact that people are doing a fair amount of guessing of places that have already been ruled out, and people are jumping perhaps too soon to guessing particular places.

What you know: This is an inhabited non-volcanic tropical island, one of a group, smaller than the Isle of Arran, not recently in the news. Rock climbing occurs there, and it does not have significant amounts of water on it.

It is located in a named body of water that is typically understood to be in the Indian Ocean. (As long as we are taking the broad definition of ocean there is no ambiguity about which ocean it is in.)

It is not Sentosa, Réunion, Al Hallaniyah, Komodo, Java, one of the Maldives, or one of the Andaman and Nicobar islands. It is not in the Arabian Sea or the Bay of Bengal. It is not African or Australasian, or in the East Indies. It is not a British Overseas Territory.

I will tell you for free that I think you are unlikely simply to guess it without more information. I don't expect everyone here to have heard of it (it may fail the Rosie test) but I would expect some or several people to have done so. It does have a couple of claims to fame. And there was a reason why I chose it as a subject; it's not just some random small island.
Is this island inhabited by natives of the territory (as opposed to resident scientists)?
Does it have a name in English?
Phuket Island?
Was it affected by a tsunami a few years ago?
Inhabited by natives? I'd guess that most of the inhabitants are natives of the country of which this island is part, but very few would have been born on the island itself. There are also certainly some foreign residents, but I doubt if there are many scientists.
Name in English? Not exactly sure what you mean, but I think the best answer is No. (It can certainly be referred to using the English language, and in that sense the answer is yes, but I presume you mean something more than that.)
Phuket? No. *applause* (As an example to clarify my previous answer, I would say that "Phuket" is not a name in English as I understand the term; it is simply an English phonetic representation of the island's name in Thai.)
Tsunami-affected? Yes. *applause*
In the Andaman Sea?
Though if the answer is yes then we may need a clarification on the meaning of 'East Indies'.
Andaman Sea? Yes. My bad, sorry. I thought I knew the meaning of East Indies and didn't even bother to check. Turns out there's been a gap in my geographical knowledge all my life.
Yes, wikipedia's definition was wider than I expected, but since you'd already quoted wikipedia I assumed you were going with it. BTW I think I have a very good candidate for the answer, but I'll wait a couple of hours or until someone else has had a go.
OK, I'm feeling a bit less stupid now
According to Britannica online's entry on East Indies:

"Historically, the term East Indies is loosely applied to any of three contexts. The most restrictive and best-known use is as a synonym for the islands that now constitute the Republic of Indonesia (formerly known as the Netherlands Indies, or Dutch East Indies); these include the Greater Sunda Islands (Borneo, Celebes, Java, and Sumatra), the Lesser Sunda Islands (stretching eastward from Bali to Timor), the Moluccas, and New Guinea (including Papua New Guinea on the eastern half of the island). In a second, larger sense, East Indies refers to the Malay Archipelago (including the Philippines), which now is more commonly called insular (or archipelagic) Southeast Asia. Finally, in its broadest context, the term East Indies encompasses the foregoing plus all of mainland Southeast Asia and India."

By this account, islands in the Andaman sea would be included in the second definition or the third, depending in turn on the exact meaning of "Malay Archipelago", but not in the first.

On the other hand, that discussion also suggests that perhaps I should not have had reservations about including this island in an archipelago.
Were you there, either during or shortly after the tsunami?
Was I there? No. I have never been there.
Koh Phi Phi?
No, it begins with ผ
เกาะ ผีผี (pronounced Pee Pee) is indeed the correct answer. Somehow, Tuj never shows up when he is really needed. (Phi Phi actually refers to a small group of islands, but when answering I had in mind the largest, Phi Phi Don.)

One บะถน handed over.
kob kun krab. I couldn't remember the name, but I searched for 'beach movie location' as I remembered about the fuss over bringing in palm trees etc.

This next one is ANIMAL with Abstract connections

Human Animal?
[GL] Human? - YES
Alive?
[Rosie] Still with us? - NO
English-speaking? (Back when he or she was still alive enough to speak, of course)
[CdM] Anglophone? - NO
Male?
[irach] The stronger sex? - YES
Infamous?
European?
[FGZstar] Infamy, infamy? - NO
[CdM] European? - NO
Real person based on whom a movie was made?
Alive at any time during the 20th century?
[irach] Movie subject? - NO
[CdM] Around in C20? - NO
Biblical figure?
A national leader?
A single individual?
(We've been assuming that, but haven't confirmed it)
[irach] Biblical? - NO
[Rosie] National Leader? - Not as easy to answer as you'd think, as it depends on the definition of both words. I'll say NO(ish)
[CdM] individual? - YES
A state governor?
Begins with P?
[CdM] For shame! Mea culpa
Of African racial descent?
(Within the last three hundred years, I mean, since I believe we all are in another sense).
[FGZstar] gubernatorial? - NO
[Tuj] Pstarting? - NO
[Projoy] Out of Africa? - NO
From the East Indies?
(proudly flaunting my new-found knowledge)
[CdM] East Indiaman? - NO (by any definition)
Alive in the C19th?
Sonam Gyatso?
[Projoy] 19th century? - YES
[CdM] Dalai Lama(III)? - NO
From North America?
Does the abstract part of the answer on the card result from this gentleman lending his name to something or somewhere?
Spanish-speaking?
[Projoy] Unlikely (though not impossible) given that he was not an Anglophone. We're probably down to S. America, Russia or China.
[INJ] The first or the third, depending on which Wikipedia page you go to...
[Projoy] N America? - NO
[Dujon] Eponym? - NO (but don't give up on the abstract element - I reckon you need it as well)
[CdM] Hispanophone? - NO
BTW There was a slight murmur of appreciation in the audience at CdM's previous question. Also, to clarify, I don't know that the male in question spoke no English or Spanish, but it's unlikely and they certainly weren't his first language.
Hannibal?
Have you read any of the previous answers?
[FGZstar] Hannibal? - NO (of course there could be a Hannibal who didn't come from Africa and was alive in the 19th Century)
Associated with a specific religion?
[CdM] Mm. Lots of non-Anglophones in Mexico, I'd've thought, in the C19th, not to mention now, and I daresay some indigenous North American people in the C19th might not have spoken English...
[Projoy] A specific religion? - YES *applause*
From Asia?
[Projoy] Asian? - YES
[CdM et al] An apology is in order from me this time. I have had another look at Wikipedia and by the longest stretch of the definition with the longest stretch he could be described as from the East Indies - just not by any use of the term I've ever come across. Can we agree going forward that we'll only use the term for the Malay/Indonesia/Borneo/Phillipines etc. archipelagos?
From China (C19 borders)?
[Projoy] Chinese? - NO
Do you know the name of this individual?
[Projoy] I didn't mean unlikely in the sense that it was unlikely you'd be able to find a non-Anglophone in N. America. I meant unlikely that the solution to this AVMA would be North American and non-Anglopohone. If you see what I mean.
[CdM] Do I know his name? - YES, and I would accept that - but that's not what's on the card.
from Asia Minor?
[Projoy] Little Asia? - NO
From the Middle East?
[Projoy] Middle Eastern? - NO (Between you & CdM you've straddled the target very well)
From India?
[FGZstar] From India? - Depends - Not from somewhere that is currently in India.
From what is now Pakistan?
Well, that was a bit painful
[Projoy] Land of the Pure? - YES *relieved applause*
Gotama Siddhattha?
[GL] Sid Arthur? - NO (wrong country and 2400 years too early)
Dalip Singh Sukerchakia (aka The Last Maharajah)?
(yes, I looked him up)
Actually, he probably spoke English, didn't he? Hm...
Ranjit Singh, Lion of the Punjab?
(aka "Napoleon of the East", to boot)
[Projoy] Last Maharajah? - NO
Lion of the Punjab? - NO
You're right, it's quite plausible that the person in question had some English given where and when he lived, but I don't know that and it wouldn't be helpful to know in any way I can think of.
P.S. Don't forget the Abstract - there's more to it than just a nickname.
Is this person popularly supposed to be divine in some way?
And I'm not talking about a fabulous hairdo.
[Projoy] Divinity? - NO but *some applause*
Imran Khan?
Is The Answer the title of a person or an office they would hold?
Hm. I must admit I'm even drawing a blank with Wikipedia on this one.
Does the abstract element link to some present-day phrase or saying?
[Software] Imran Khan - NO
[Projoy] Titular? - YES *another small ripple of applause*
[CdM] Phrase or saying? - NO
I think you're only a couple of questions away - in fact, if you came up with the answer I think you would have a pretty good idea that it was correct. The religious element was important, but I had no idea it existed when I chose the subject and I expect it's not really going to help much except as confirmation. The abstract link is probably the key.
Does the title take the form "The X of X"?
(Or rather, the X of Y, I suppose)
[Projoy] 'X of Y'? - YES *the audience starts getting coats and bags together*
Is the "Y" a specific city, such as Lahore?
[Projoy] Why a city? - NO, not a city
Not the Nawab of Pataudi, shurely?
[Rosie] The Noob? - NO (Assuming you mean Iftikir or Mansoor Ali Khan, the cricketers, then it's wrong century & country again)
Is the "Y" the name of a "nation" - e.g. a body of people even if not necessarily a recognised state?
[Projoy] Nation/people - Let me put it this way. It's the name of a geographical area and, by extension, the people who inhabit it. Whether they constituted a 'nation' or 'people' at the time is less clear.
Is the area Punjab?
[Projoy] - Punjab? NO
BTW it would be a bit of a blow if someone else were to jump in and get it now, wouldn't it? (This the last time I'll say it, but - Abstract?)
OK - the abstract connection... to do with a published work of fiction?
[Projoy] Printed Page? - YES *audience perk up again*
Fiction? - Category Error (If forced, I would say Yes, but that's misleading)
Is this person mentioned in a religious work?
The Akond of Swat, as in Edward Lear's "Who or which or why or what, Is the Akond of Swat"...?
Well, there you go
After all Projoy's hard work!!!
It is The Akond of Swat (or Akhund, if you prefer) - Muslim Saint and key regional figure on the NW frontier of the late C18 and first half of C19, but much better known these days because of Mr Lear.
The baton passes to irach.
Not kicking myself
It's OK. I hadn't actually heard of the AoS, so probably would have taken me several days more working solo!
Profanity restraint.
Two in succession I haven't heard of. This is so-ooo boring.
[Rosie, all] Constructive suggestion: perhaps when a player sets a new answer, they could email it to Rosie first, and he can confirm he's heard of it before the round commences. That way, there'll be a more level playing field.
This one is ANIMAL.
Human?
Alive?
[Glogin] Yes, human.
[Projoy] Dead as a doornail.
Unique individual?
Female?
[CdM] ? . . . ;)
[Dujon] As opposed to a collection of humans. And also, perhaps, as opposed to an individual defined by his or her role (e.g., 'The British Prime Minister'), so at any moment the answer is an individual, but that individual is not the only person to have held that role. But yes, "specific" rather than "unique" might have been a bit less of a tautological repetition of the same thing.
From a country which has English as one of its official languages?
Died in C20?
[CdM] Yes, a unique named individual.
[Dujon] No, not female.
[FGZ*] No, no English speak.
[Pro :)] Did not die in C20.
Died in C21?
Died in C19?
A political figure?
A deeply religious chap?
[CdM] My aplogies, but I couldn't resist. Your response had me chuckling out loud. Thanks.
European?
[Rosie] Sorry you feel that way about it, but I don't consider one of Edward Lear's best-known poems to be obscure and the Swat valley has been in the news quite a lot in the last few years. The other information about him was new to me.
A renowned thinker?
[Gusset Login] Did not die in C21.
[Projoy] Did not die in C19.
[CdM] A political figure... yes, in a manner of speaking.
[Dujon] As far as I know nothing is really known if or whether the individual was a deeply religious chap or not.
[ImNotJohn] Not European.
[FGZStar] He certainly had a following, but was not specifically known as a philosopher-type renowned thinker.
Primarily known as a warrior?
[ImNotJohn] In some biographical accounts, he is known as a warrrior.
Died after CE1500?
From the Indian subcontinent?
[Projoy] Yes, he died after CE 1500.
[Raak} Not from the Indian subcontinent.
Died before CE1700?
[Projoy] Yes, died before CE 1700
Chinese?
Was he an artist of some sort?
[INJ] Well, the poem was about the fact he knew nothing about him... ;)
[Raak] Not Chinese.
[Tuj] Not an artist.
South American?
So far this man seems to have been singularly unimpressive. Was he Russian?
[Projoy] Not South American.
[Dujon] Not Russian.
The leader of a group of people?
From North America?
(by which I mean everything from the Panama isthmus to Alert)
Begins with P?
From the territory that would later be the USSR?
[ImNotJohn] Yes! The leader of a group of people.
[Projoy} Yes, from North America (the audience sits up, roused from slumber induced by apathy, and now bristles with anticipation).
[Tuj] Does not begin with "P".
[Raak] See the last response to Projoy. Therefore, "Nyet".
Of European ethnicity?
From Mexico?
[Rosie] Not of European ancestry.
[Projoy] Yes. Si, si! Méxicano.
Moctezuma II?
Moctezuma II it is. A baton shaped like an Aztec battle mace, decorated with quetzal feathers is handed over to Projoy!
Koh Phi Phi (potassium hydroxide, half of one plus root five, half of one plus root five), The Akond of Swat, as opposed to the Akond of Chemical Insect Repellant, and Moctezuma II, presumably related to the Retributively Laxative One. You children are all far too clever for me.
[Rosie] Yep, Moctezuma II is better known to many (including me up to a few moments before I made my guess) simply as Montezuma. I daresay irach would have accepted that answer too...
OK, the next is ABSTRACT
The unbearable lightness of being?
The set of things Rosie knows?
Dismay?
Abstractness?
[jim] Lightness? *some audience laughter* NO
[INJ] What Rosie Knew? NO, altho I considered very seriously setting that!
[Phil] Dismay or Datmay? NO
[Raak] A study in abstraction? NO, altho I wish I had thought to set that.
A way of life?
Related to the arts?
Begins with P?
[Knobbly] A way of life? NO
[INJ] Related to the arts? YEAH, SOMEWHAT
[Tuj] Begins with P? YES
(Hypothesis: the discovery of the initial letter always encourages players to start making random guesses much earlier than they otherwise would, resulting in slower actual progress toward the answer. However, drawing players' attention to this hypothetical phenomenon might counteract the effect by nudging them toward persistence with deductive questioning instead of randomly guessing words beginning with P for three days.)
Does it consist of words?
A condition that affects people?
Is it you?
[Raak] Not quite sure how to interpret the question. The Answer obviously consists of [the] words [on the card] but the words making up The Answer don't refer to something that consists of words (e.g. "a phrase") How'd I do?
[!John] A condition? NO
[Tuj] I'm so vain, you bet I think this clue is about me? NO (I've already been an answer in this game, in fact).
Paulo Picasso?
Musical connection?
(I figure I'm allowed a serious question as well.)
Tangible?
[CdM] PP the Painter? NO
[CdM] Music? NO.
[FGZstar] Can be tanged? NO
Related to religion?
Is it a human invention?
Persistence?
[Phil] Religious? NO
[Tuj] A human invention? I WOULD SAY NOT, altho there are arguments either way.
[GL] Persistence? NO :)
Related to mathematics?
Is the answer on the card a single word?
[CdM] Numbery? BARELY
[Tuj] alloneword? There are three words on the card, but there's definitely a one word answer I'd accept.
So, so far, we have tenuous connections to both the arts and mathematics.
Did the Ancient Greeks know about this?
[INJ] Greeks knew? I EXPECT SO, altho I know of no evidence they did.
(Having googled the topic of The Ancient Greeks and The Answer, and discovered it to be an extremely subtle matter, I'd put it another way: The Answer was certainly manifest in Ancient Greece and its existence was unlikely to have been overlooked, but for reasons that will become clear, a straight yes would be a significant oversimplification.)
Would yer average Guardian-reading Surrey pensioner be aware of this?
[Rosie] If you've never heard of this, I simply won't know how much lower it's possible to set the bar in future :P
Related to physics?
[irach] Physics-related? YES, SOMEWHAT
Something to do with light?
[Rosie] Light-related? YES.
Is the word 'rainbow' relevant?
The summer solstice?
[Duj] Rainbow-relevant? YES, to an extent.
[Rosie] Wicker Man weather? NO.
Prism-related?
Polarization of light?
Lightning?
Maxwell's equations?
[CdM] Prism sentence? NOT REALLY
[irach] Pole dancing? NO
[Rosie] Stormy weather? NO
[Raak] Maxwell? NO
Colour-blindness?
Photosynthesis?
Does a particular colour appear on the card? (Pink, purple, puce...)
[Rosie] Color-blindness? *audience applause and cheering* NO
[Knobbly] Sunshine into cells? NO
[CdM] YES!! You have landed right on it. The words on the card are The Color Puce, all of which appear in your question, so I think you win. *hands over a purplish-brown sort of baton*
Well! That was unexpected!
This one is ABSTRACT, with various ANIMAL connections (and more tenuous MINERAL and VEGETABLE connections)
Barbeque?
An activity?
Just in case anyone wondered about the Ancient Greek stuff, the name for the color puce dates back to C18 France, and there's no extant evidence that the Ancient Greeks had a word for it. In fact there seems to be considerable doubt that Ancient Greek words for colors even really map to current concepts of color, with the color words not necessarily describing a shade, but physical properties instead or as well as.
Barbequan? No
Acting Town? No. I doubt that I will be able to keep this theme up for long :-)
A Human Construct?
Made-up Vale? Yes.
Animal sacrifice?
Anything to do with the tube?
(May as well be obvious if no-one else will)
Killingdone? No.
Tubish? Interesting question. The simple answer is No. Nevertheless, there is one connection, highly tangential yet perhaps still significant.
Is the animal connection entirely human?
Human animals? Yes. There are different kinds of animal connections, to various different humans.
To any particular human is there just one type of animal connection?
Types of connection? Let me try to clarify. There are, I would say, three distinct animal connections, each of a rather different kind. Each is a connection to a particular individual or group of individuals. (So I'm not sure I understand the question, but I think the answer is yes.)
Begins with P?
[CdM] Phew! Can't wait for that answer to become clear at the end of this round!
Is this a form of commendation bestowed upon an individual, group of individuals or posthumously?
If that makes sense.
Begins with P? No.
Commmmendation? No.
Is the Tube connection to do with the name of a particular station?
Is it artistic?
Tangential tube connection to particular station? Yes *applause*
Artistic? Um, yes. I suppose. *laughter*
Sorry, I'm traveling right now so internet connection is a bit interrupted
Is the human connection to specific individuals, alive or dead?
The Butcher, the Baker and the Candlestick maker? With Baker Street being the tangential Tube connection and representing three different groups of individuals...
Connected with the world of work?
Specific individuals alive or dead? As I said, I am thinking of three connections. One is to a group of specific individuals, all alive to the best of my knowledge. The second is to a single specific individual, alive. The third is to a specific individual who is fictional.
BBC? No. (The tube connection is very specifically to an individual station. It is tangential in the sense that the link between that station and the answer is somewhat indirect. Pursuing that connection might not be the easiest way to the answer, but it is one possible route.)
Work-related? No.
Is it associated with a particular location?
Associated with a particular location? Difficult to answer. In one sense, yes. But in the sense that you probably intend, I think the best answer is No.
Invented within the last 100 years?
Cor, right. Let's muck in.
Invented in last hundred years? Yes (though "invented" is not the usual word).
[Tuj] In response to your prior question, I'll add for free that the reason that it's difficult to answer is that the particular location is -- to the best of my knowledge -- fictional.
Is it associated with television?
[CdM] Very sporting of you, and very conscientiously answered =)
I'm glad someone's still playing!
TV-related? No.
Harry Potter related?
Do any of these people have something in common besides The Answer?
Pottery? No.
Things in common? The group of individuals have in common the fact that they are part of this group of individuals. The specific fictional individual is linked to this group. The specific real individual is, as far as I know, completely unconnected except through The Answer.
Any religious connection?
Science-related?
Is the group of individuals a popular beat combo?
Any connection to sport?
Religious connection? No.
Science-related? No.
Popular beat combo? Yes! *loud applause*
Sporting connection? No.
Is the answer a song title?
Song title? Yes. *applause*
The Diary of Horace Wimp?
Is the fictional human a character named in the song?
Horace Wimp? No.
Fictional human named in the song? Yes. *applause*
Eleanor Rigby?
The rise and fall of someone or other?
The unmourned Ms Rigby? No.
Rise and fall? No.
Incidentally, I seem to have beaten Wikipedia with this one. None the less, I am confident that many people here will know the answer. I am even tentatively confident that Rosie is one of them. :-)
Also incidentally, it occurs to me that, for completeness, I should note that there are a large number of other animal connections, but these are uninteresting and unhelpful in terms of getting to the answer.
My Old Man (who's a dustman)
Tentatively confident that this is not the answer, but may help.
Gorblimey trousers? No. You were warmer with Eleanor Rigby (though not warm enough to get applause, remember)
Mr Postman (please)
Another pot-shot before I start asking serious questions.
Is the fictional person, who is named in the song, male?
Is the character named in the title?
Postman Pat? No.
Fictional person male? No.
Eponymity? Yes.
Mr Tambourine Man?
[Rosie] That would have to be Ms Tambourine Man, so No.
Is the real person named in the song?
Real person named in the song? The name of the real person appears in the song, but not as a reference to the real person.
A song from before 1960?
The Girl from Ipanema?
re - Tambourine Person. It was getting late, even for me.
Mrs Robinson?
Pre-1960? No.
Ipanemanian? No.
Anne Bancroft? No.
A British song?
Let me summarise/recapitulate and answer Rosie's question as I do so.

You are looking for a song, written since 1960. performed by a popular* beat combo. The title of the song includes (or perhaps is) the name of a female fictional person. The song also has a connection to a real person (actually, many real people, but only one is of interest); to clarify my earlier response to INJ, the real person shares a name with the fictional person named in the song.

Now here is some more information for free: Wikipedia informed/reminded me that there are actually quite a few songs with the same or related titles. Some of these songs are better known than the one I have in mind (which is, remember, sufficiently obscure that it is not mentioned in Wikipedia). Of course, finding one of these other songs would be a possible route to the answer. The song that I have in mind is British. The song that I have in mind also has a tangential connection to a particular LU station. A fictional location is named in the song, but I don't think that's helpful.

You are not likely to guess it outright (although that's not impossible). Your best route might be to focus on the real person at this point. Or, if you like, on the LU link. You are also welcome to ask questions about the other songs that share the same title, but I warn you that most of them are not songs that I know.

*It's fair to say it was popular at the time. It's also fair to say it is largely forgotten now, I think.
Nonetheless, is the song from the sixties?
Is the real person still alive?
Taking the suggested route
Song from the sixties? Yes.
Real person still alive? Yes.
(Oh, and two other LU stations are tangentially linked to the LU station that is tangentially linked to the song.)
Is the character referred to by their given name (with or without surname)?
Caroline by the Fortunes?
A Beatles song?
Referred to by given name? Yes.
Caroline? No.
Beatles? No. I remind you that I said that this particular group is largely forgotten.
Does the song title consist of the person's given name and family name and nothing else?
as in 'Eleanor Rigby' or 'Jennifer Eccles'
Is the surname mentioned in the title?
[INJ, Projoy] The song title consists of a given name (which might or might not be a nickname) and nothing else.
A propos of not much, I'm amused that there is a connection (via a rather better known performer) that I can draw between Software's guess and the answer. But that on its own is unlikely to be of help to you. If you need a clue later I might elaborate on that.
Lola?
Lola? No. (I really do think it is unlikely you will just guess it)
Was the real person an adult when the song was released?
Real person an adult? Good question. I'm almost certain that the answer is yes.
Is the real person British?
British? Yes.
The real person: renowned as a great beauty at the time of the song?
Great beauty? *audience laughter* Whether the person was a great beauty I have no idea. I'm confident that the person was not widely renowned for the fact.
Was she known mainly for her profession?
Is the person known simply by their first/given name?
Real person known mainly for profession? No. (But the fictional person, perhaps yes.)
Real person known simply by first/given name? The least misleading answer is Yes, though the strict answer is probably No.
Is the real person most famous for being married to or in a relationship with someone substantively famous?
Real person famous for relationship? No. Check your assumptions.
Is the real person the same for every questioner?
So (trying to summarise it for myself). The answer is a song title from the sixties released by a group who are not particularly well-known now (I'm thinking of the stature of The Honeycombs). The title is a woman's given name/nickname . That name is also the name of a real individual also identifiable solely by that single given name (or perhaps more likely, nickname). The real individual is still alive and was probably? an adult when the song was released.
Real person the same for every questioner? Yes. But if you had asked the question a bit differently I might have had to give a very different answer.
And I think your summary is accurate. Don't think I know/remember the Honeycombs (but then I had forgotten the name of the band that sang the answer before I looked it up, even though I remembered several of their songs).
Was the real person we've been talking about famous at all?
Was the real person famous? No. *applause* Now question your other assumptions. :-)
Having googled The Honeycombs, I think INJ has it about right. The group that sang the answer is perhaps a bit better known (although its Wikipedia entry is shorter), but certainly roughly equivalent in stature.
Speaking of The Honeycombs, the first second of this video is worth seeing.
Is the real person only identified by a relationship?
Like 'Grandma'
BTW - Can't look at Youtube from work. This is getting to be more and more of a restriction.
Is this non-famous real person also female?
Real person identified by relationship? No.
Non-famous real person female? No! *applause*
(I'm reasonably confident, by the way, that INJ will know/remember the answer, and I think most Morniversers of my age or older will also know it. I'm less sure about Young Master Projoy and his contemporaries -- they may need to use the google -- although I think there is a good chance that he (they) would at least know another song by the group.)
Rosie?
I can think of 2 60's songs with that title. The one by a group would be The New Vaudeville Band IIRC (not googled)
INJ has it! Rosie by the New Vaudeville Band is the answer on the card. The timeless lyrics, for those of you who have forgotten, began
There's a pub in town called the Rose and Crown
And one day I met Rosie there.
(dadada)
She served my drink with a knowing wink
I knew that I would get somewhere
(dadada)
I heard her whisper she was mine
So we left before closing time

Rosie was on the B-side of Finchley Central. Timeless lyrics:
Finchley Central is two and sixpence from Golders Green on the Northern Line
And on the platform, by the kiosk, that's where you said you'd be mine
There we made a date
For hours I waited
But I'm blowed, you never showed.

However, the NVB were most famous for Winchester Cathedral, a top ten hit in the UK, and number one in the US. I won't bother to reproduce the timeless lyrics. Part of my reason for choosing this answer was the discussion of music over at mcios, where INJ observed that a lot of that 60s music we thought was so great doesn't actually hold up all that well. And yet, and yet...

The link to Software's Caroline guess was through Neil Diamond (Sweet Caroline and Cracklin' Rosie). I will leave it to Rosie himself to tell us if he was a (a) an adult and (b) a great beauty in 1967.

*takes baton made of polyvinylchloride, drills very narrow hole through the center along its entire length, compresses the ends of the cylinder until it is a flat disc of about 17.8 cm diameter, and gives it to INJ*
Rosie, oh Rosie. It's raining when you look the other way.
And again Projoy asks the key question and someone else does a Cavendish on him. I feel almost embarrassed (but not enough to give up my turn).

OK, this one is VEGETABLE

Is it a pea?
Welp, I'm glad the cavalry arrived for that one =)
Edible?
[Tuj] Begins with a 'P' (followed by an 'e' and an 'a')? - NO
[CdM] Comestible? - NO
Is it classed as a tree?
Is it Alive?
Is it unique?
[Knobbly] Tree-y? - YES *applause*
[GLogin] Alive? - YES
[Tuj] Oneique? - YES
Is it notable for its dimension?
Tane Mahoute?
Notable for other than physical reasons?
(CdM et al) (a) Adult in 1967? I have never been an adult except where it matters. (b) A great beauty? Only two Morniversers, Software and Chalky, know what I really look like. Ask them, while I quietly yet viciously twist their arms. I was a little prettier in 1967 but not much, time having been kind to me.
(INJ) That's the only Rosie I can remember. (Don Partidge). I started work at a perfume factory as a chemist in Jan 67 and immediately got called Rosie by the lads in the factory, from my first name, and hence the monicker. That having been established, when the song came out in 1968 they started singing it at me. All quite aimiable, despite my white coat and their boiler suits since I was quite young (25). I don't remember Rosie by the New Vaudeville Band BTW.
A form of grass?
The Royal Oak at Boscobel?
This is going quickly
[Tuj] - monster bonsai? - NO
[FGZStar] Lord of the Forest? - NO
[Rosie] Other than Physically famous? - Hmmm, I could argue that either way depending on what you mean by physical reasons. Let's go for NOish.
[Dujon] Bamboo-ey? - NO
[CdM] The original Royal Oak? - NO
Famous due to location?
In Europe?
Would Robin Hood have strong connections?
[FGZstar] Famous for site? - NO
[CdM] European? - NO
[Dujon] Majorly Hoodie? - NO (though that's where I started before deciding on the actual answer)
Superlative in any respect?
(physically, I mean)
Is this a specific tree-y object (as opposed to a unique family or grouping)?
[Projoy] x-est? - YES *prolonged applause*
[Dujon] Specific tree? - YES
Apologies for infrequent responses - heavy decorating weekend, and discovered the wireless router only works properly when it's in the room we've stripped out.
Is it notable for its age?
"Methuselah" the bristlecone pine from California?
We have a winner
Projoy has it - it is Methuselah - the current oldest known living tree (I would have accepted that as an answer). After his efforts in the last few, I regard that as well-deserved.
One slightly bristly baton passed on
Timber!
Phew. Glad to have finally felled one after so long (altho as with Akond of Swat, I wouldn't have gotten "Rosie" very quickly, if at all, using the deductive method. Still enjoyed both tho).

This one is VEGETABLE and/or ABSTRACT (and topical). Probably a bit of mineral involved too, but unlikely to help.
The Great Pumpkin?
Is it largely paper?
The Sunny Sun on Sunday?
[Raak] Pumpkin? NO
[Tuj] Largely paper? YES, typically.
[CdM] The Even Newers of the World? NO
Does it have words on it?
A book?
[Raak] Has words on? YES *applause*
[INJ] A book? NO
A printed apology?
:o)
Related to the phone hacking scandal?
[Software] Desperate PR exercise? NO
[Raak] Phone-hacking related? YES
A letter of resignation?
[Raak] YES! and please accept mine from the chairmanship. *hands over envelope*
MINERAL.
Unique?
Stone?
[jim] Unique.
[Projoy] Not stone.
Man made?
[K] Man made.
An alloy?
The Eiffel Tower?
Unique?
Oops. Already answered. Located in Europe?
The Golden Gate bridge?
[D] Not an alloy.
[GL] Not the Eiffel Tower.
[P] Mmm...slightly tricky. No, not in Europe.
[i] Not the Golden Gate.
Has it ever been in Europe?
[P] (nerdish nit-picking mode) tricky... (common sense mode) No, it's never been in Europe.
Bigger than a house by volume?
In the Middle East?
[P] Bigger than a small house, maybe not bigger than a large one.
[CdM] (common sense mode) Not in the Middle East.
Is it a single, discrete structure (that has been made up of mostly the same molecules for the length of its existence)?
On the surface of the earth?
Begins with P?
[P] Roughly, yes, a single discrete structure.
[INJ] *applause!* Not at the moment.
[Tuj] Does not begin with P.
Space shuttle Atlantis?
A non-geostationary manmade satellite?
[P] no, because...
[CdM] Atlantis it is. Have this space alloy baton carved out of the scrap metal of our space dreams.
Standing on the shoulders of others' coattails there.
This one should be easier than my last couple, I think. It is VEGETABLE (and I suppose technically MINERAL as well).
Salted potato crisp or chip?
edible?
Smaller than a toaster?
Crispchip? No.
Edible? Yes
Smaller than toaster? Not really a well defined question.
Smaller than a standard two slice toaster?
http://www.amazon.co.uk/Wahl-Slice-Toaster-Touch-ZX515/dp/B000SZ085Y/ref=sr_1_11?ie=UTF8&qid=1311252738&sr=8-11
Larger than a toaster in some dimension(s) but smaller in others?
Is it unique?
Does it consist of a single vegetable ingredient?
e.g. Mashed Potato rather than sliced bread
Mineral salt?
Solid?
A single, discrete item?
Is its main purpose to be eaten?
Or is its edibility merely because of material choice?
Liquidy or pureed?
Toaster questions? Still not well-defined.
Unique? No.
Single ingredient? No.
Salty? No (I can't definitively say there is no salt, but it's not what I was thinking of and I have found no mention of it).
Solid? No.
Discrete item? No.
Meant to be eaten? Yes.
Liquid? Yes.
Does it come in different flavours?
Does it come in a variety of sizes?
Different flavours? Yes, at least sort of.
Different sizes? Again, it's a liquid so the question is not really very well-defined. That said, Yes is a reasonable answer.
Could I buy it in a British supermarket?
A glass of something?
Astescbury? Perhaps not every supermarket, but I'm sure you could find it easily.
Glass of something? That's how you'd often encounter it, Yes. <*applause*
Is it (gasp) intoxicating?
Intoxicating? Yes. (No applause because the audience, knowing me, was taking that for granted.)
Old Rosie?
The brand of alcoholic beverage not the (relatively youthful) player of this game.
distilled?
Old Rosie? No.
Distilled? Yes.
A whisky?
Whisky? No. And for free, I'll tell you it is also not a whiskey.
A particular brand of distilled beverage?
Tequila?
Tequila? No. (I think I did that once before, years ago)
A brandy?
amaretto?
A particular brand?
Brandy? No.
Amaretto? Yeeeuuuuch. No.
Particular brand? Oops, sorry, missed that. No.
Invented in Europe?
European? Yes.
Akvavit?
Akvavit/aquavit? No.
Associated with a particular country?
Distilled from a fruit?
Distilled from a grain?
Absinthe?
Rock & Rye?
Associated with a particular country? Yes.
Distilled from fruit? Yes.
Distilled from grain? No.
Absinthe? No. *loud applause*
Sex and drugs and fruit-flavored whiskey? No.
I have a feeling that INJ is going to hit me with a few technical fouls on this one, revolving around certain definitions.
Ouzo?
Ouzo? No. *more applause*
Anis?
Sambuca?
Actually, no, not distilled from a fruit per se. How 'bout pastis?
And it is indeed the one that begins with P -- pastis. The technicalities that I had trouble with were (a) do liqueurs such as pastis (which is technically a liqueur because it has sugar added) that have as their basis a distilled alcohol themselves count as distilled?; and should I have at least given some applause to brandy, given that the broad definition of brandy is alcohol distilled from fruit? It was actually surprisingly hard to find what kind of alcohol typically forms the basis for a pastis, since it is the added herbs etc rather the alcohol that are its defining feature.

One provencale baton handed to Projoy
Gosh, I never knew of such subtleties. I thought they chucked fruit in a bucket, waited till it went off then poured off the juice into bottles...

These last few have gone refreshingly quickly. Here's an attempt at another swift one (famous last words) ABSTRACT
Human construct?
arrow_circle_down
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