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AVMA Take 2
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Yes, it's another round of that classic guessing game - Animal, Vegetable, Mineral, Abstract [or any combination thereof]. This effort - '03/'04 should address any queries, but then again, may just serve to confuse and baffle which some might say is the point of the game. Patience, integrity and a decent search engine may be useful ....
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A watch or clock?
[CdM] Ok.
[I] Not a knife.
[ISP] Not a whisk.
]CdM] Not a razor.
[Rosie] *riotous applause* Yes, a watch or clock.
BTW, I have not checked to see whether this is a repetition of an earlier object. If so, perhaps the time has come...
A wrist-watch?
An alarm-clock
though mine seems to be mostly plastic.
The time has come...? Noooooooooo!
[Rosie] A wrist-watch could serve as one, but...
[Irouléguy] An alarm-clock it is.
And I see that not only has that been set before, but it was set by me before. Hm...
[Raak] Set before? Hmmm, wonder why it didn't go off. Better buy a new one.
Mine didn't go off this morning, either - though that was because I didn't set it :)
Okay, our next is ABSTRACT WITH ANIMAL connections.
The Labour Party?
Totally topical.
A fictional cgaracter?
doh! fat fingers!
g/h
Rosie] Brown is the new blue? Wholly wrong (also not the answer)
Inkers] Cgarlie in the Cgocolate Factory? No
A creative activity?
Rosie] Making something? No, but this could lead to a creative activity.
Are the animal connections human?
CdM - Person to person? Yes, essentially (other animals could be involved, and it could be argued that other animals do this, but this wouldn't be a useful line to explore.)
To do with communication?
ImNotJohn - To do with communication? In a broad sense, yes, but that's not how most people would classify this.
I Say, Porter! - Mime? *shakes head, frowns*
Is this an organisation of creative people?
Rosie - Is this an organisation of creative people? No
Is it a communicative medium?
Does it involve a specific subset of people?
Kim - Is it a communicative medium? Not entirely sure what you mean by that (and a quick Google doesn't help me). I think the answer is the same as to INJ's previous question.
ImNotJohn - Does it involve a specific subset of people? A specific instance of this would involve a specific subset of people, but in general, no.

Being completely pedantic, this can also be done with/to an inanimate object, so the definition should strictly be ABSTRACT with ANIMAL and possibly VEGETABLE and/or MINERAL connections, but this is another red herring.
Anything to do with sex?
Nudge, nudge.
Rosie - Anything to do with sex? *applause* Yes (though the answer (and the thing itself) are quite SFW).
Mostly to do with sex?
Phil - Mostly to do with sex? I don't see how you could quantify it, but there are a lot of sexual connotations, yes.
A dance?
I don't recognise "SFW". *shrugs* So f------ what.
[Rosie] Suitable for work
Flirting?
(Phil) Ah! Thanks. Now, what is this thing called work?.
Would a specific instance typically involve just two people?
[Rosie] Do you do a lot of flirting with inanimate objects, then? :-) (Excluding the trombone, of course.)
(CdM) Yes - the sax section. Woo! subversive.
Rosie - A dance, or flirting? No to both (though you might well do this while engaged in either).
Sorry about the jargon - I've seen people use 'NSFW' in Another Place, so I thought it would be understood (though I used it as 'Safe for Work')
CdM - Would a specific instance typically involve just two people? *applause* Yes
Eye contact?
Rosie - 'Oo you lookin' at? No
Does this involve physical contact?
'E 'it I, so I 'it 'e.
Rosie] A touching enquiry? *loud applause* Yes
A massage?
Phil - A massage? No
Hugging?
Rosie - Hugging? Closer, but no
Kissing?
Phil] Kissing? YES - X marks the spot! Over to Phil
In that case, your next problem to solve is ABSTRACT with ANIMAL connections
Shagging?
Worth a squirt.
[Rosie] I presume you mean chasing and catching fly balls in baseball practice? Anyway, whatever you meant: Shagging? NO!
Is the animal connection human?
An action?
(Phil) Of course. Precisely that. :-)
[INJ] Human? YES
[Rosie] An action? NO
Culturally specific?
[INJ] Relating to a certain group of people? YES
Only found in a particular part of the world?
[Irouléguy] One part of the world? NO
Is the group of people related by profession?
[INJ] related by profession? NO
Is there a religious connection?
Any artistic connection?
[Irouléguy] Religious connection? YES *tumultuous applause*
[INJ] Artistic? NO
Is the answer a religion/religious group/sect?
[CdM] Religion/religious group/sect? YES *more applause*
Is it gender specific?
[Inkspot] Gender specific? NO
Scientology?
[CdM] Scientology? NO
Christian?
[Rosie] Christian? YES, but not quite the word on the card *deafening applause, followed by a few disdainful grumbles*
Christianity?
[CdM] Christianity is the word on the card - congrats!
Wot, me again?
I think that the disdainful grumblers have a point, but in any case I'll accept the baton (which was manufactured from actual genuine pieces of the crown of thorns), and offer something

ABSTRACT and MINERAL/VEGETABLE (I think), with ANIMAL and VEGETABLE connections.
Something to do with the environment?
Not grumbling, for once.
Environmental? No. Not hereditary either.
Something to do with food?
Foody? The vegetable connection has something to do with food.
Begins with P?
A method of cooking?
Is it art?
Begins with P? It does, as a matter of fact, although I hadn't noticed until you asked.
Method of cooking? No.
Art? *audience laughter* Well, it depends on how broadly you define 'art', but I think the best answer is No.
Is the "p" followed by another consonant?
This is getting out of hand
Is the P followed by another consonant? Yes, several.


Oh, you mean immediately. No.
Is it a one word answer?
In a word? No.
Is the mineral/vegetable plastic?
Is the mineral/vegetable manufactured?
Plastic? In part (I think).
Manufactured? Yes.
(The "I think" is not any kind of trick answer; it simply reflects that I am having to take an educated guess at one aspect of the answer.)
Is it a two word answer?
Two words? No. I'll tell you for free (because I think it will be no help at all :-) ) that I vacillated between two different ways of expressing the thing on the card, one of which is six words long and does not begin with P, and on of which is shorter and does. I went for the latter.
All right, I'll be generous
It is three words including the definite article.
Passing the buck?
The deer don't stop here? No. *a scrap of applause that quickly dies away, followed by laughter, scattered applause, and much chattering*
Are both the Abstract and the Mineral/Vegetable descriptions of the same thing ?
Feeling a bit thick. Shut up at the back there.
Abstract and Mineral/Vegetable descriptions of the same thing? Yes. (Good question.)
Is the abstract meaning figurative? (E.g. the cat's whiskers)
Figurative? No. *more scattered applause, though*
Game-related?
Game related? No. *amused discussion in the audience*
Part of an animal?
Part of an animal? No.
Is this specific to a particular culture or country?
Culturally and geographically specific? Yes. I would associate it primarily (and perhaps exclusively) with one country.
Is that country the UK?
UK-based? Yes.
A dish (i.e an edible preparation)
Edible preparation? No.
Is the animal human?
This one's a bugger, innit?
Human? No.
Is the animal one particular species?
Animal = one particular species? Yes.
Is the animal emblematic?
Does this date from before 1500?
Emblematic? No. *some audience laughter*
Pre 1500? No.

A summary: This is ABSTRACT and MINERAL/VEGETABLE, with ANIMAL and VEGETABLE connections. The answer is three words, including a definite article, and begins with P immediately followed by a vowel. The abstract and mineral/vegetable are different descriptions of the same thing. The mineral/vegetable description is in part plastic (I think) and is manufactured. The abstract meaning is not figurative. The animal connection refers to one particular non-human species, and is not emblematic. The vegetable connection is connected to food but neither it, nor the overall answer, is a dish.

The answer is primarily or perhaps exclusively associated with the UK and dates from sometime after 1500. It is not art (except under a very broad definition), nor a method of cooking. It is not environmental, nor is it game-related.

Three questions provoked odd reactions from the audience, viz: "Passing the buck?", "Is it game-related?", and "Is the abstract meaning figurative? (E.g. the cat's whiskers)". The suggestions that it was art and that it was emblematic also provoked amusement.
The Pink Panther?
Pink Panther? No *considerable audience applause, nonetheless*
A fictional beast?
Going from the particular to the general.
Fictional beast? Yes. *applause*
Originally from a novel?
Once a novelty? No.
Twentieth century?
Twentieth Century? Yes.
A fearsome creature?
Originally from TV?
A fearsome creature? *audience laughter* No, not fearsome.
Once a novelTV? Yes. *applause*
Is the first word a name
Is there a question mark missing?
Parsley the Lion?
Parsley the Lion? Yes! *hands over garnished baton*
[CdM] Was your first thought "A very friendly lion called Parsley"?
[CdM] Oh well done, didn't see that coming.
Well, that was a surprisingly successfull de-lurk. Here's a plain old ABSTRACT
42?
The letter P?
Human construct?
[Raak] 42? NO
[Tuj] The letter P? NOPE (nor does it begin therewith)
[Rosie] A human construct? YES
Does it have to do with language?
[Raak] Hot tongue action? NO (except inasmuch as all answers in this game do)
Is it a philosophy?
Science-related?
[IS,P] That was indeed what I first planned to put on the card! I was amused by Irouléguy's early guess of "Passing the buck" because, even though it was completely wrong, it had the right opening syllable (at least in some accents), the right structure, and an animal as the last word.
Anything to do with sport?
CdM] Completely wrong but structurally similar - story of my life, really...
To do with the emotions?
[Phil] Osophy? NO is the best answer. * some applause *
[CdM] Sciencey-ness? NO, not really...
[Ig] Sport? NO
[Raak] Emotions? I GUESS SO.
Something to do with mental health?
Stoicism?
[Rosie] Mental health? NO, not specifically
[Raak] Stoicism? NO * scattered but uncertain applause *
In retrospect, maybe the is-it-a-philosophy guess should have had * sustained and enthusiastic applause*
Connected to a belief system?
[CdM] A belief system? YES is the least misleading answer *applause*
It isn't anarcho-syndicalism, is it?
Is this an attitude?
By that I mean such things as homophobia, racism, nationalism, patriotism and their like.
[Tuj] Anarcho-whatsit? NO *a few Anarcho-syndicalists in the audience take audible issue with this statement*
[Dujon] An attitude? NOT PER SE, but *some applause*
Is this specific to a culture or country?
[Ig] culture or country specific? There are defensible YES and NO answers. I think NO is probably more helpful.
Is there a specific person associated with it?
[Raak] Specific person associated? YES *applause*
Is it a one word answer?
Is this an -ism?
[Tuj] One word? NO
[Chalky] ism? NO
A cult of some kind?
[CdM] Reaching for one's Cult .44? NO
Is it a named law?
Is there a person's name in the answer?
[Raak] A named law? NO
[Phil] Nominated? NO
A religion?
[Phil] Religion? NO
Is it a theory of something?
[Raak] A theory? NOT AS SUCH, but for free I will mention it is theoretical. *applause*
An ideal?
[Phil] An ideal? YES! *some laughter and applause*
Is the associated person still alive?
"Slow food"?
[Phil] living person? NO - (it's actually associated with two people)
[Ig] Slow food? NO
Marx & Engels?
Are they Gilbert and Sullivan?
[Ig] Commies? NO
[Indian Pooh-Bah] GODDAMIT NO, I hate G&S.
Svengali and Trilby?
Has this anything to do with gay rights?
[Raak] Hypnotist and Hat? NO
[Chalky] Gay rights related? NO is the most helpful answer (altho it could have to do with it - but so could many other things).
Are the two people fictional?
[Phil] Fictional people? YES and NO
A fictional character, and the creator of that character?
[Raak] Fictional character? YES. Creator? NO.
To do with education?
Doest
Does the fictional character origina
Does the fictional character originate from the last century?
Sorry - work keeps getting in the way
[Phil] Education? TANGENTIALLY, but the most helpful answer is NO.
[Ig] C20th character? NO
RECAP
This thing is an ABSTRACT human construct. It is connected to philosophy but is not a philsophy per se. It is theoretical, but not a theory per se. It is connected with an attitude but is not an attitude per se. It is connected to a belief system, but is not a belief system per se. It is associated with two people, one of whom is fictional. The fictional character does not originate in the C20th. I originally said flatly that it was not connected to Science or Religion, but on further research, I find it is connected to both, tho not in a particularly famous way. Although it might be connected to many things (anarcho-syndicalists, for instance, might consider it connected to anarcho-syndicalism and gay rights campaigners might consider it connected to gay rights), it is not especially connected to mental health, sport or cults, is not an -ism, named after anyone or a law.
Oh, and it is an ideal.
Ooh, you've all gone quiet.
Does that mean I win? I'm off to Rome on Saturday, so hopefully someone will ask a breakthru question before then.
A field of study?
[Ig] Field of study? NO
To do with "rights", as opposed to specifics, such as "gay rights"?
[Phil] Rights? NOT IN PARTICULAR
Is the fictional character British?
[Phil] British? NO
Is the fictional character European?
Is the real person an actor? Playing the part of the non-fictional person?
[Ig] Character European? YES! *applause*
[Phil] Actor? NO (but think about it the other way around...)
I'm thinking, but nothing's happening :-(
Hamlet's soliloquy?
[Phil] Happiness is...? NO, but you're getting warmer.
Is the fictional person acfually mentioned in a work of fiction (as opposed to just being an imaginary person)?
Is the fictional character from Shakespeare?
[Phil] Person from a work of fiction? YES! *applause*
[Tuj] Bardish? NO
So, to clarify what I think I understand: the two associated people are (i) the author of a fictional work and (ii) a character in that work. However, the answer itself is neither the author, nor the character. Is that correct?
[CdM] The author? NO! *audience gasps*. A character? YES. The answer is neither? CORRECT.
I suppose you could associate it with the author, come to think of it, but I'm not sure that many people do. But I may be wrong in that, so if it helps you to consider that it's associated with three people, then plz do so...
Fiction from pre 1000AD/CE?
[Phil] Pre-1000CE? NO
Man and Superman
[INJ] Clark Kent and alter ego? NO
Pre 20th century fictional character?
[Phil] Pre-C20th, YES *applause*
Is anyone ready for a clue?
I think I'm about ready, as my train of thought seems to be stuck for eternity at Clapham.
a clue
By far the most significant fact about The Answer so far revealed is that it is "an ideal".
Oh drat - that's the fact that's confusing all my other thoughts. Better sleep on this one then.
Brave New World?
[CdM] Miranda Huxley? NO
PS. [Phil] Bear in mind that there is more than one meaning for the word "ideal"...
A Platonic ideal?
[Raak] Perfectly Plato? NO
Hmm....Is/was the real person a writer?
My Greek O-level already reminded me of that :-)
OOPS!!! That was me, not Projoy, sorry!
[Projoy, er Phil] A writer? YES
Is it associated with a psychological condition?
doo-de-doo, third week of this clue
[INJ] Psychological condition? NO

Another recap: This ABSTRACT - which could be called "an ideal" - is associated with two people: a European (non-British) fictional character from the period 1000-1900CE and a real person (from the same period), who was a writer. It could also be associated with the author (also from the same period) who created the fictional character, who is not the same person as the real-person-writer, and is not Shakespeare, Gilbert, Sullivan, Marx nor Engels. There is a strong philosophy connection, altho it is not "a philosophy" per se, nor "an attitude" nor "a belief system", but is connected to these ideas. There are also science and religion connections. It is not a law, stoicism, eponymous, a platonic ideal, to do with sport, anarcho-syndicalism, a psychological condition, a cult, a method of cooking, a field of study, Man and Superman, "Brave New World" nor to do with education. It could be argued that it is country/culture specific, but also that it isn't (I think no is the most helpful answer).

Anarcho-syndicalists would associate The Answer with Anarcho-syndicalism. Gay rights campaigners would associate it with gay rights.
Man and Superman?
[Chalky] M&S? NO, see my reply to INJ. Not Nietzsche, Shaw or Siegel and Shuster.
Anything to do with utopia?
[Raak] Utopia? VERY NEARLY!! *tumultuous applause*
The Lost World?
[INJ] Lost world? NO *some applause*
Nirvana?
[Phil] Nirvana? NO *audience muttering about Europe*
Communism?
Bit of a wild stab in the dark, this one.
[nights] Communism? NO, though a Communist would disagree.
Is this anything to do with fascism or ethnic purity?
Is the answer the title /author of a book?
sorry if this has already been askeded
Eutopia?
Were the ideas of this author reflected in the work of Bunyon's Pilgrim's Progress, though the latter was far more 'religious'?
[Chalky] Fascism/Ethnic Purity? NO (altho Fascists and ethnic puritans would disagree)
[Chalky] Title/author? NO
[Phil] Eutopia? NO, but that is arguably a closer guess than "Utopia" *a huge oooooh of approval from the audience*
[Dujon] Were the ideas...? I haven't read/studied Bunyan, but going by Wikipedia's description of PP, I would be inclined to say NO.
"The best of all possible worlds"?
Metaphysico-theologico-cosmolonigology?
Is the fiction 19th century?
[Phil] C19th, NO
[Raak] All that jazz? NO, for
[Irouléguy] YES!!. The very words on the card. I must admit I didn't read the Wikipedia entry on Leibniz before setting the clue, so didn't realise in time that the idea had such a close relationship with science and theology in its initial incarnation, having first heard of it via Voltaire's Dr Pangloss.
Congrats, Irouléguy. I'd never have got that, as I'd never heard of it, alas, and my web-trawling didn't lead me anywhere near it :-(
Thanks, Phil - and well done Projoy - that must be a record! I can't claim any great web-trawling skills, it just came to me. I think I did the play in French A level *cough* years ago, but I didn't know of the connections with Leibniz.

Well, our next should be a short one, so here goes - it's ABSTRACT, VEGETABLE and MINERAL with ANIMAL connections.
Is it fictional?
[Ig] Not sure what took so long on that one, altho there did seem to be a bit of a lack of deductive questions in the middle stages. [Phil] Well, there you go, and I was convinced, Candide aside, that it was an everyday expression...
Is the animal connection human?
[Projoy] At least I've learn a new word ('theodicy'). Tangentially; I'm a bit concerned about where the "all" comes from in a translation of the French "le meilleur des mondes possibles", but I don't think it changes the meaning enough for me to lose sleep over, and I'm sure it's been discussed to death over the last 293 years already. That was a criticism of whoever translated it, not you, btw.
The seed that fell on stony ground?
Projoy - Is it fictional? No
I thought it was an everyday expression too, but I just twigged it from your answer to 'Utopia' and the European connection.

Phil - Is the animal connection human? Yes
I thought 'theodicy' was Homer's follow-up...

Raak - The seed that fell on stony ground? No
Raak] If that was a prediction rather than a guess, then you may be right.
Is the vegetable wood?
Projoy - Is the vegetable wood? Yes, but there are other vegetables/vegetable products also involved.
Is any of it edible?
Raak - Filling your face? What it's made of isn't edible, but there are edibles in it.
Is paper involved?
Raak - Is paper involved? There's paper in it.
Is it a place?
Chalky - Is it a place? *the audience awakes cheering* Yes.
Fictional?
[Raak] Fictional? NO. See Ig's answer to me, above. :)
Is it larger than a town?
The Natural History Museum?
Projoy - Is it larger than a town? *applause* Than some towns, yes...
Team-hosting - I like it!
I Say, Porter! - The Natural History Museum? No
An island?
Is it a country?
Is it man-made?
Apologies for my long absence - back at the keyboard now.
Projoy - An island? No
Tuj - Is it a country? No
Raak - Is it man-made? Yes
A building?
Does it still exist?
Projoy - A building? No
Raak - Does it still exist? Yes
A defined municipal area?
Projoy - A defined municipal area? *collective "oooh" from the audience, mixed with the occasional muttered "cleverclogs" A most precise definition of the class of things to which this particular belongs.
In England?
A green belt?
Projoy - In England? No
Raak - A green belt? No

Coincidentally
In the UK?
Does it begin with P?
Projoy - In the UK? Yes
Tuj - Does it begin with P? No
A single specific named area?
ImNotJohn - A single specific named area? Yes

In case it wasn't clear, the answer to Projoy's "defined municipal area" was an emphatic "yes".
Is it a place where things are sold?
Scotland?
Raak - Is it a place where things are sold? Things are sold in this place.
Projoy - Scotland? OCH AYE
The Gorbals?
ImNotJohn - The Gorbals? No
The Toy Parliament?
A current administrative division?
+ <i>
Raak - Wholly rude about Holyrood? No
Projoy - A current administrative division? Yes
+ </i>
Does it incorporate any islands?
Does it incorporate any mainland?
Does it fall entirely within another defined municipal area?
Projoy - Does it incorporate any islands? No
CdM - Does it incorporate any mainland? ;) It's on the mainland of Scotland
ImNotJohn - Does it fall entirely within another defined municipal area? No
Is "shire" anywhere in the name of it?
Does it have historical significance?
Projoy - Tolkein connections? No
CdM - Does it have historical significance? *applause* Yes
Culloden?
CdM - Culled? No
Stirling?
Does it have the word "and" anywhere in its name?
Phil - On the money? No
Projoy - Does it have the word "and" anywhere in its name? *applause* Yes
The Highlands?
(Couldn't resist)
Dumfries and Galloway?
CdM - The Highlands? *applause* No
(Couldn't resist) That's a little harsh - 1314, 1715, 1745?
Projoy - Dumfries and Galloway? No

CdM is both conceptually and geographically closer
Perth and Kinross?
Ross and Cromarty?
(Although that does contain a few islands)
But and Ben?
[Raak] Flobble obble obble! Weeeeed!
I take it that's a nobbleobble.
Projoy - Perth and Kinross? No
ImNotJohn - Ross and Cromarty? No
Raak - But and Ben? No
I Say, Porter! - [Raak] Flobble obble obble! Weeeeed! Thank you, but I've given up

People should look again at the various meanings of 'municipal', and at CdM's last question.
Callander?
Aye Janet.
So is this thing not "a settlement which has the status and powers of a unit of local government." (Wikipedia)?
ImNotJohn - Callander? Nae, Doctor
Projoy - So is this thing not "a settlement which has the status and powers of a unit of local government." (Wikipedia)? Yes, it is - most of the previous answers didn't fit that definition, hence my reminder.
Is it uninhabited?
Yes, it is not, or yes, it actually is? :-)
If it is a municipal area, and it is a current municipal area, and if it is not incorporated wholly in any other municipal area, is it, in fact a unitary authority of Scotland?
Raak - Is it uninhabited? No
Projoy - Yes, it is not, or yes, it actually is? :-) Yes, it actually is

*deep breath* It is a current municipal area, not incorporated wholly in any other municipal area, but it is not a unitary authority.
Is it a parliamentary constituency (for either parliament)?
Is it a London Borough?
Projoy] Is it a parliamentary constituency (for either parliament)? No - though I'll throw in as a clue that the names of the two constituencies (one in each parliament) that this is located in consist of the same three words, but not in the same order.
nights] Is it a London Borough? Barking & Dagenham up the wrong tree - it's in Scotland

And so to bed.
Presumably this thing also crosses a unitary authority boundary?
Projoy - Presumably this thing also crosses a unitary authority boundary? No

Time for a recap? This is a place in Scotland, a defined municipal area, wholly on the Scottish mainland, not falling within another defined municipal area, which is a current administrative division. It is larger than some towns (a question which reaped applause). It has historical significance, and the word 'and' in its name. It could also be defined as "a settlement which has the status and powers of a unit of local government." It is not a constituency (for either parliament), nor is it a unitary authority, and it falls wholly within a unitary authority. Most of the specific wrong guesses have been neither settlements nor municipal areas (though the Highlands got applause despite being neither). It is not Callander, Culloden or Stirling.

Are we working on different definitions of 'municipal'? My dictionary gives "of or pertaining to a town, city or burgh", and I'm using it as a synonym for 'urban' here. Apologies if different definitions have caused confusion.
The Balmoral Estate?
I feel that "falling wholly within a unitary authority" contradicts "not falling within another defined municipal area" (taking "municipal" to refer very specifically to local government, as per Wikipedia), but the clarification helps!
Aberdeen?
PS. I'm not sure what else in Scotland has "the status and powers of a unit of local government" other than unitary authorities (except the very small community councils), but I guess we can argue about it after the answer is revealed. :)
St Andrews?
Projoy - The Balmoral Estate? No
I feel that "falling wholly within a unitary authority" contradicts "not falling within another defined municipal area" (taking "municipal" to refer very specifically to local government, as per Wikipedia), but the clarification helps!
Sorry for the confusion- the dictionary I was using equated municipal with urban, but looking around Wikipedia that seems to be less than universal (though Wikipedia also has contradictory definitions of what exactly this place's status is).

Projoy - Aberdeen? No (but *applause* for part of your PS) On further inspection, the answer to "a settlement which has the status and powers of a unit of local government" should have been "settlement" YES "status" UMM "powers" NOT REALLY, NO, UNLESS YOU COUNT ORGANISING BANDSTAND CONCERTS AND A FLORAL COMPETITION.

CdM] St Andrews Yes - a hole in one! Well lurked, sir. Let me hand over this mashie-shaped baton while I prepare to debate the precise nature of Scottish local government after the 1973 settlement.
Heh. Well, I guess it does have a Community Council (According to Wikipedia and the BBC, tho, the two parliamentary constituencies are exactly identically named - however, the two sources disagree about the exact syntax of the name!). Ah well...
Who are you calling a lurker? I asked five questions, until I got stuck on (a) the same problem that confused Projoy and (b) the differing constituency names. My guess of the Highlands was intended as a joke; at that time I was just assuming the answer was of the A and B variety. Anyway
This is Mainly Mineral and Vegetable.
A geographical feature?
Is it unique?
Geographical feature? No is the best answer.
Unique? Yes.
(You could also make a case that this is ABSTRACT, by the way, but I think that is less helpful.)
Is it a piece of countryside?
Is it man-made?
Does it begin with P?
Countryside? No.
Man-made? Yes.
Begins with P? The answer to that question begins with N.
One or more buildings?
One or more buildings? Yes, the mainly mineral part refers to one or more buildings. *applause*
(More precisely, the mainly mineral part mainly refers to one or more buildings. Mainly.)
Does it (physically) exist?
Physical existence? Yes.
The vegetable component - is that the building's contents?
Projoy] Sorry about the constituency names - I got that from the Wiki page on St Andrews itself. The parliaments' official pages do have the same name. I really should know better than to trust Wiki...
CdM] Good questions they were too - sorry about the lurker crack. The applause for the Highlands was meant to acknowledge that your joke was on target.
Was it established in the last 100 years?
I think this one will fall fast
Vegetable component = building's or buildings' contents? Yes. *applause*
Established in last 100 years? No.
Is this edifice and contents a museum?
Is it a university?
Spitalfields market?
Kew Gardens?
In the UK?
Museum? No. * a smattering of applause, none the less*
A university? No.
Spitalfields? No.
Q? No, 007.
Inuk? No.
Open to the general public? (with or without a fee)
Houses of Parliament?
It its purpose to display the vegetable matter?
s/It/Is
Is it in Europe?
Open to Public? Yes.
HoP? No.
Purposeful veggie display? No. *some applause accompanied by some whispered debate*
In Europe? No.
Is the vegetable matter inside it by design?
Vegetable matter by design? Yes.
Is it in the U.S.A?
Does your definition of 'Europe' exclude the U.K.?
Inus? Yes.
Does my definition of 'Europe' exclude the U.K.? Of course it doesn't! Does your definition of 'Australasia' exclude Australia? :-)
A park or public garden?
Park or Public Garden? No. This may be a time to, as INJ often exhorts, examine your assumptions.
Do the buildings have roofs?
Is the vegetable matter alive?
Do the buildings have roofs? Yes. *laughter*
Living vegetables? No.
A church or other religious building?
Godhouse? No. *some chattering and laughter in the audience from people who know Néa*
Is it Botanical gardens?
In North America?
Is this a group of buildings mainly with a single purpose?
(I suppose that's really two questions)
Hershey's Chocolate Factory?
Nobody listens to CdM
Botanical gardens? No. (See non-living vegetable matter)
North America? Yes. (See in the USA, above)
Group of buildings mainly with simple purpose? Yes. *applause*
Willy Wonka? No.
Is the answer the name of a distinct metropolitan area?
Is the vegetable mostly wood?
Is the vegetable matter intended to be consumed in some form?
Wall Street?
The White House?
Metropolis? No.
Mostly wood? Yes. *applause with that subtle timbre that indicates relief*
Vegetable intended for consumption? No, at least for the standard narrow meaning of 'consumption' (see 'wood', above)
Wall Street? No.
The White House? No. *tiny smattering of applause*
A government building?
The Bridges of Madison County?
Government building? Yes.
Bridges of Madison County? No.
The Supreme Court?
Supreme Court? No.
Is it in New York?
In New York? No.
In DC?
Did you know you'd changed INJ's "single purpose" to "simple purpose" in your answer?
In DC? Yes.
Was I aware of my typo? No. The group of buildings mainly has a single purpose, and I suppose you could say that purpose is pretty simple as well.
Camp david?
The Library of Congress?
Camp David? No.
Library of Congress? YES! One baton duly recorded and put into storage. Projoy can have this stick instead.
OK. VEGETABLE (+ some MINERAL), or ABSTRACT
The Woodentops?
I feel thick after not knowing anything about 2 of the last 3 answers :-(
Vegetable in its natural state, eg a forest, meadow etc?
[Phil] The most stupid, boring programme ever made? NO
[Rosie] Natural state? NO
Is it unique?
Printed paper conveying ideas?
[Quendalon] Unique? The best answer from my research is NO.
[Raak] Printed paper conveying ideas? YES
An Abstract?
A book?
Does it have a single author?
[Rosie] An abstract? NO, not in that sense.
[Raak] A book? YES! *applause*
[Quen] One author? YES.
(NB. just for simplicity, I'm going to take my facts for this round from Wikipedia)
Fiction?
[Raak] Fiction? NO (some laughter)
Is this a biography of some kind?
A reference book?
[Duj] Biography? NO
[Phil] Reference? I would say YEEES.
Magna Carta?
A record of the proceedings of some body?
[Rosie] Poor Hungarian Peasant Girl? NO
[Raak] Proceedings of a body? NO *much audience laughter*
Encyclopaedia Morningtonia?
Available on Amazon?
Originally written in English?
Religious in nature?
[Kim] E.M.? N.O.
[Raak] Amazonian? YES
[INJ] English orginally? NO
[Q] Religious? YES
Originally written in a south Asian language?
To do with Islam?
Christian?
[Ig] South Asian? YES
[irach] Mecca-noid? NO
[Phil] Crucials? NO
The Mahabharata?
What a great Channel 4 series that was.
The Lotus Sutra?
[Phil] Mahabarata? NO *applause*
[Raak] Lotus Sutra? NO *sustained applause*
Does the answer have the form "The [X] Sutra"?
The Kama Sutra?
Lurking shamelessly
He who lurketh laugheth lenthily
[Ig] A hole in one! As it were. It is The Kama Sutra. * hands over slightly suggestive-looking baton*
Stolen from under Raak's nose, for which apologies. Our next is ABSTRACT with MINERAL and ANIMAL connections.
Shagging?
Going with the flow. Not too sure about the connections, though.
Rosie - Shagging? *sardonic laughter* No

The KS does illustrate most possible permutations of connections...
Is it a human construct?
Standard opening.
Does it begin with a 'T'?
A recording?
[Projoy] I'd just like to say how much I'm enjoying re-reading your "YEEES" answer to my "reference book" question.
Anything to do with death?
Kim - Is it a human construct? Yes
Chalky - Quick cuppa? No
Phil - A recording? No
Projoy - Anything to do with death? *applause* Yes, though not directly.
A religious idea?
An addiction?
Is it fictional?
[Chalky] Eh? You do have some funny ideas.
Projoy - A religious idea? Religiously derived, yes
Dujon - An addiction? No
Tuj - Is it fictional? *animated discussion among audience* Part of it (hopefully) is fictional.
- Eh? You do have some funny ideas.*applause*

I should say that the mineral bit of the definition is slightly tongue-in-cheek, and a dead end as an avenue of enquiry.
Tithing?
Is it an old idea, now largely ignored?
Does it pertain to a specific religion
?
Projoy - Tithing? No
Rosie - Is it an old idea, now largely ignored? It is an old idea (though I can't find any dating for it). The best answer for "largely ignored" is that it's not applicable.
Kim - Does it pertain to a specific religion? No
The Golden Rule?
Raak - Whoever has the gold, makes the rules? No

Amplifying the answer to Kim's previous question: the religious reference in the answer is common to many religions, but this would have originated as a reference to one particular religion.
To do with the afterlife?
Projoy - To do with the afterlife? Yes
From a Middle Eastern originated religion?
To do with some kind of underworld?
Re-incarnation?
Projoy - From a Middle Eastern originated religion? Yes
Tuj - To do with some kind of underworld? *scattered applause* in some religions, yes (though not the originating one).
Rosie - Re-incarnation? No
Purgatory?
Croydon on a Saturday afternoon.
Limbo?
A Christian idea?
Rosie - Purgatory? No
Phil - Dancing? No
Projoy - A Christian idea?*applause* Yes (though not exclusively - as above)
Hell?
Rosie - Hell? *applause* Damned right! 'Hell' is one of the five words in the answer
A snowball in Hell/?
A snowball in Hell's Chance?
... I meant. Altho I don't suppose there's any likelihood that's the answer.
Projoy - A snowball in Hell's Chance? *loud applause - the audience sit bolt upright awaiting the next move* Sooo close - but not the exact words on the card
A cat in hell's chance?
The day hell freezes over?
A cold day in hell?
And the next move it is - "a cat in hell's chance" being the exact words on the card. One kitten now passed over to Projoy.
ANIMAL, VEGETABLE and MINERAL
Is it, or does it contain, an entire ecosystem?
Animal human?
[Quen] Entire ecosystem? NO
[Rosie] Animal human? NO
Culinary in nature?
[Quen] Culinary? YES.
A dish, served hot? (both)
Is the mineral component substantial (i.e., more than a pinch of salt)?
[Rosie] A dish? YEEES. Served hot? NO
[CdM] Mineral substantial? NO
Food for humans?
[Raak] Human beans? YES
Is it traditionally a starter?
[Phil] A starter? NO
Made from a specific animal?
It is traditionally a dessert?
[Ig] specific animal? YES, altho check your assumptions
[Kim] A dessert? YEEEES, but see answer re: dish. In fact in retrospect, NO would be a better answer to the dish question.
Lemon curd?
[Q] Citric Spread? NO
Whipped cream?
[GIII] No, thank you.
A sauce?
Lassi?
[Q] Saucy? NO
[Raak] Come Home? NO
Is it revenge?
[Kim] Revenge? NO (remember that the answer to "is it a dish?" has been revised to NO...)
Is it liquid?
Does it contain an animal 'product'?
Would it be eaten at a specific time of year?
[Raak] Liquid? NO
[Chalky] Animal product? YES
[Tuj] Specific time of year? NO
Does it contain alcohol?
Does it taste sweet rather than savoury?
Contains Dairy Produce?
[Q] Booze? NO
[Chalky] Sweet? YES
[INJ] Dairy? YES
Does its preparation require cooking?
[Q] I would say YES, but that's a broadly worded question.
Is it a dressing?
[Rosie] Dressing? NO
Is milk the animal product?
[Chalky] Got milk? YES!
Rice pudding?
[Rpsie] Lovely rice pudding for dinner again? NO (remember that the answer to "is it a dish?" has been revised to NO...)
Cheese?
Are we using the standard definition of cooking: 'preparing food by a process which includes the application of heat to it' - or the bachelor definition 'any part of meal preparation, including looking up the phone number of the local pizza delivery'?
Yoghurt?
[INJ] Cheese? NO (this is sweet, not savoury, as per Chalky's question)
Is it 'cooked' by the standard definition of cooking? YES, but be careful with your assumptions. It was a very broadly phrased question.
[Kim] Yoghurt? NO
*recalls that there is such a thing as sweet cheese and apologises to INJ*
Custard?
[Custard] Graham III? NO
Milkshake?
Milk Chocolate?
[Kim] Milkshake? NO
[Chalky] Milk Chocolate? *tumultuous applause* The Answer does indeed contain milk chocolate (but The Answer does not contain the words "milk chocolate")
Angel Delight (milk choccy version)
Hoping it doesn't count as a dish.
Is it a pudding of any sort?
Walnut Whip? [teehee]
An after dinner mint?
[Rosie] Angel Delight? NO (don't forget I only said Yeeees to "dessert", not "YES!")
[Q] Pudding on the Ritz? NO
[Chalky] Walnut Whip? NO *strongly supportive applause*
[Dujon] After Dinner Mint? NO
Is it ever eaten on its own, not as a part of a meal?
Mocha?
Is it an item of confectionery?
[Rosie] Eaten on its own? CERTAINLY
[irach] Mocha? NO
[Phil] Confectionery? YES! *applause*
(and I've just looked up dessert in Wiktionary, and realised that this basically isn't one, so sorry about that)
Does the answer involve a brand name?
[Raak] Brand name? YES! *applause*
Creme Egg (yum)
[Phil] Creme Egg? NO *exactly the same amount of applause as for Walnut Whip*
A Mars bar?
[Raak] Mars Bar? NO
A bar of chocolate as opposed to a box of sweets?
A Cadbury's Flake?
Does it begin with P?
Is it crunchy?
Made by Cadbury's?
[Rosie] Bar? NO
[Ig] Flake? NO
[Tuj] Begins with P? NO *smattering of applause*
[Chalky] Crunchy? NOT REALLY
[Phil] Cadbury? NO
A Hershey Bar?
May they rot in hell for inventing such an insult to chocolate.
Oh bumbags, it's not a chocolate bar - scratch my last question please :-)
Made by Nestlé?
[Phil] Hershey Bar? NO *some applause, all the same*
[Phil] Formula pushers? NO
A Tim Tam?
[Chalky] Coffee straw? NO
It's got to be Nestlé Power Bar? Shurely
If not that brand - is it a Nestlé product?
MilKy Bar?
A British confectionery?
[Chalky] It's not Nestlé
M&Ms?
Thanks Phil. Missed your question.
[irach] M & M's - are they not 'crunchy'?
[Phil] British? NO! *audience gasps, several ladies faint*
[irach] eminems? NO *and yet, a faint stirring in the audience as if they sensed a connection with The Answer, yet it is too obscure to express in more than a sigh*
MMM...Maltesers?
[Ig] The lighter way...? NO
Is this product made by Mars, Cadbury, Nestle or Hershey?
Think we need to eliminate
Is it a European manufacturer?
Hershey's Kisses?
[Chalky] Is it one of those manufacturers? Strictly, YES, but beware.
[Chalky] European? NO
[irach] Hershey's Kisses? NO *some applause*
(please also note that previous questions have ruled out Cadbury and Nestlé)
Rolo?
strike that. It's a Nestlé product.
Almond Joy?
Hershey's Bites?
[Chalky] The joy of the almond? NO
[Chalky] Hershey's bites? NO
Hershey's pops?
I'm getting bored now
[Chalky] Hershey's Pops? NO (I fear you did not heed my "beware" on your manufacturer question!)
Hint to avoid boredom: ask more deductive questions and stop making wild guesses :-P
A seasonal confection?
An M&M/Mars product? Like Minstrels, say?
Wild guesses? I was riding on the applause meted out to Hershy-ness answers.
[irach] Seasonal? NO
[Chalky] Mars manufactured? NO, which as you so rightly say leaves Hershey revealed as the manufacturer. But again, I say beware. :)
Is the brand name in the answer "Hershey" (or "Hershey's")?
Does this involve chocolate chips?
Is it solid (i.e. does not flow, wobble, or ooze, even if cut open)?
[Phil] Is "Hershey" in the answer? NO *more audience gasps*
[irach] Chips with everything? NO
[Raak] Solid? YES
Reese's Peanut Butter Cups
[Chalky] YAY! It is indeed A Reese's Peanut Butter Cup. One baton filled with peanut goop handed over.
*sighs* Oh well, as wikipedia says "possibly one of Hershey's best-known products due to long-running massive advertising campaigns". Another never-heard-of one for me. Still, I shan't give up!
(Phil) Me neither.
Ey?
What in the world is a Reese's Peanut Butter Cup? Having read Phil's Wikipedia extract I am just as in the dark as would be a chocolate coated peanut. Yes I could, but no I won't, go a-Googling.
*went a-googling*
Phew! Thanks PJ for a challenging, yet somehow obvious, little puzzle [ie; not obviously Hershey, not a bar, not crunchy]. Having put SO much effort into it, I feel pleased to have finally nailed it :-)

Next up:

A N I M A L / A B S T R A C T

Animal instinct?
A symbolic animal?
[irach] Animal instinct? NO
[Raak] A symbolic animal? NO
Something I'm likely to have heard of?
Is the animal human?
[Phil] Something you're likely to have heard of? YES :-)
[irach] Is the animal human? YES
Fictional?
Male?
Alive (if not fictional)?
[Raak] Fictional? YES
[Projoy] Male? YES
[Phil] as above
Originally from a novel?
A young person?
[Irouléguy] Originally from a novel? YES
[Rosers] A young person? YES is probably the most useful answer.
A novel from before 1950?
Do some or all of the words on the card appear in the title of the novel?
[Reese's] Have none of you ever watched E.T.? (OK, it's not exactly the same product, but it is close.)
[Reese's] They are on sale in the UK now, too. You can get 'em in my local corner shop, and very nice they are too.
Dorian Gray?
Has the character appeared in film?
Is/was the novelist English?
[CdM] I've only seen the re-release in 2000 (or whenever it was), and only because my children insisted. I didn't pay attention though.
[Projoy] A novel from before 1950? NO
[CdM] Do some or all of the words on the card appear in the title of the novel? NO . But despite the negative answer the * audience applauses* because it was a significant question.
[Kim} Picture in the Attic? NO
[Raak] Has the character appeared in film? YES
[Irouléguy] Is/was the novelist English? NO
CORRECTION! [PJ] A novel before 1950? YES YES YES
sorry chaps - schoolgirl typing error
Is/was the author (and indeed his character) French?
A novel before 1900?
Is/was the novelist British?
[Dujon] Is/was the author [and character] French? YES!
[Projoy] A novel before 1900? YES
[Phil] British? NO
Is the author Dumas?
American author?
[Graham III] Dumas? YES *hoorah hoorahs from a very lively audience*
[Projoy] American? Nah
I am now out and about for a couple of hours and will not have access to the 'net tomorrow - so keep 'em coming. We can wrap this up by mid-afternoon.
D'Artagnan?
Oops. Didn't read previous answer re: nationality of author
Porthos?
'The Man in the iron Mask'?
All "Three Musketeers"- like the candy bar?
Edmond Dantès?
The Count of Monte Cristo?
Sorry - got delayed
[Irouléguy] Porthos? NO
[I'mNotJohn] The Man In The Iron Mask? NO
[irach] All 3 Musketeers? NO
[Graham III] The Count of MOnte Cristo? NO .. but .. * mega-cheering from audience* because ...

[Raak] Edmond Dantès? HAS GOT THE ANSWER ON THE CARD!

Chalké passés le baton to Raak.
Free at last! Drat, I've only tunnelled into another cell. This one is VEGETABLE, with ABSTRACT connections.
Is it edible?
Not edible.
Is it wood?
Yes, it's wood.
Is it Norwegian?
[CdM] No reason it couldn't be, but not specifically. (Norwegian?) Not a Christmas tree either.
Is it alive?
Not alive.
Is it a specific (one-off) article?
Is it a carving/sculpture?
[INJ] Not a specific article.
[Phil] *murmuring in the audience* Mm...no. Not a carving or sculpture.
Is it the cross on which Jesus was crucified?
[Raak, Chalky] Whoops, forgot they were the same person...!
Does it resemble its original form (i.e. looks like, or rather like it did when it was alive?)
[G III] Not the Cross.
[Projoy] Does not resemble its original form.
Has the wood been chopped/mash/shredded/generally bashed around to achieve its current state?
[Chalky] The wood is undistressed.
[Projoy, clarification] That is, it is not a tree.
An outdoors object?
Assuming being sawn, planed etc does not cause distress.
[Rosie] Not an outdoors object.
So it has no bark?
[Projoy] No bark. Wood, processed from its original state in the tree, but not in the destructive and ham-handed ways mentioned by Chalky.
Has it been carved?
Would this have been created by a carpenter or cabinet maker?
As opposed to an artist or lumber merchant.
Is this specific to a particular country or culture?
[Phil] Not carved.
[Dujon]The audience murmurs at one of those words. Taking that as four questions: no, possibly, possibly, and no. (I had to look up Wikipedia to find out what a carpenter was, more precisely than someone who works in some way with wood.)
[I] Not very specific.
Is it created in order to contain something?
[Projoy] Does not contain anything.
Is it a part of something?
Has the wood been 'turned'?
[I] Complete in itself.
[Chalky] The wood has been turned.
Ornamental and decorative?
Is there symbolism attached to this turned wooden item?
[Chalky] Not ornamental or decorative.
[Phil] Not symbolic.
[Phil, re "carved'] Actually, carving might have a part to play in its creation.
Found in the home?
Used in a game?
[Phil] It can be found in some homes.
[I] Not used in a game.
Is it smaller than a telephone box [the proper red one]?
[Chalky] Smaller than a telephone box.
Is it essentially long & thin?
Defined as more than 3 times as long in one dimension than in either of the other two.
P.S. Where's Tuj, we don't know this object's initial P-ness?
Can you put something on it?
[INJ] It could be long and thin, but not esentially so.
[Chalky] You can put something on it. *sounds of demurral from the audience, whereupon the chairman produces one and demonstrates putting something on it. "Aha", say the audience.*
Does it have a primary specific function?
Is it larger than a toaster?
[CdM] It has a primary specific function.
[Chalky] It can be larger than a toaster.
A rolling pin?
[Rosie] Not a rolling pin.
A wooden alarm clock?
[CdM] Brrthbbthb? No.
There is actually a smidgen of Mineral in this, but it's primarily Vegetable.
Aah .. NOW you tell us :-)
Does it frame something?
[Chalky] Not a frame.
Is this a tool?
Is it a kitchen utensil?
A mug tree?
[Chalky] It performs a function, but it wouldn't ordinarily be called a tool.
[ " ] Not a kitchen utensil.
[Projoy] Not a mug tree.
Is this a prosthesis?
[Dujon] Not a prosthesis.
Is its cross-section circular for its entire length?
A board of some kind?
[Phil] Not wholly circular.
[Rosie] Not a board.
Is it typically used in conjunction with some other object?
[CdM] Yes. Various other objects.
Could you buy one in a depaertment store?
[Phil] What's with the posh accent?
[Phil] It's not the first place I'd look, but you might find one thaere.
Could you buy one in a haerdwaer store?
Is it a hatstand?
Is the mineral element nails? Or screws? or Glue?
[CdM] Not found in a hardware store.
[G III] Not a hatstand?
[ " ] Could be nails; wouldn't be screws or glue.
Are most of us likely to have one (or more than one)?
Is it a piece of furniture?
[Cdm} That's how it's spelt in Flemish.
[I] Most of us are unlikely to have one. I have one, though.
[R] Not furniture.
Does it have any moving parts?
An abacus?
[Q] It has moving parts.
[CdM] Not an abacus.
Is it a descant, treble, tenor, alto or bass recorder?
Or even a Sopranino?
Is it a type of flute?
{Chalky] Not a wind instrument of any sort.
Is it a musical instrument?
[Phil] Not a musical instrument of any sort.
Is it used in sport?
[Phil] Not used in sport.
Are the nails that could be present used simply to join pieces of wood together, or do they serve some other function?
(The only way in to this problem that I am seeing right now is the odd notion that this could include nails but not screws.)
Does one have to 'hold' this thing in order for it to function?
[CdM] The nails (or other fasteners) hold it together.
[Chalky] Hm...part of its function requires handling it, part requires not handling it.
Does it have a handle?
Have these been around since before 1900?
[CdM] No handle.
[Projoy] I don't know, but I think it's very likely to have been around since before 1900.
Are they or could they ever be made of something other than wood?
A wooden arras?
[Hi CdM - seems like we're posting at the same time. Have to confess, I'm fascinated by this particular puzzle, but have to go out in half an hour so will miss any activity this afternoon].
Is it customarily of European origin?
[CdM] They could be made of other things, but I've never come across them made of anything but wood.
[Chalky] Not a wooden arras.
[Phil] Yes, European.
*going off on one, like she does*
C'mon Raak. Does this audience have a pulse? Or does it merely murmur at the question of carpenter v cabinet maker and then 15 hours later summon up the energy to demur at the notion that something 'could be put on top' of this thing? Hey, I know you're a cool dude an' all that, but please - can we have a bit of encouragement, or even a clue? :-)
Time for a precis I think:

It is or does:

made of wood
undistressed
possibly created by a cabinet maker or artist (audience murmurs)
complete in itself
turned wood
found in some homes
smaller than a telephone box
possibly long and thin but not essentially so
able to have put something on it
has a primary specific function
can be larger than a toaster
used in conjunction with various other objects
have moving parts
does have mineral fasteners to hold it together, but these are not screws or glues
require handling as part of its function (CARE - see also the 'not' section)
very likely to have been around prior to 1900 AD
possible that this could be made of material other than wood, but the Chairman has not seen such
European

It is not or does not:

edible
alive
specific (one-off) article
carving or sculpture (though audience reacts)
the Calvary cross
resemble its original form
an outdoor object
retain bark
carved (though might have a part to play in its creation)
specific to a country or culture
contain anything
ornamental or decorative
symbolic
used in a game
a toaster
a rolling pin
a wooden alarm clock
normally purchased in a department store (though one might)
found in a hardware store
a hatstand
something that most people would have, though the Chairman is blessed
a piece of furniture
a frame
a tool (despite it performing a function)
a kitchen utensil
a mug tree
a prothesis
wholly circular
a board
a musical instrument of any sort
used in sport
requires not handling it as part of its function (CARE - see also the 'is' section)
have a handle
a wooden arras

NOTE: Ruddy 'eck that's long. Please forgive me if I've missed something.
Raak, you might run your eye over it in case I've misinterpreted anything. Ta.
Sorry, CdM
Nor is it an abacus
[Dujon] I think you left out a "not" -- this is something that most people would not have, although I do.
Is its purpose connected with art?
[Projoy] *cheering in the aisles* Yes, connected with art.
An easel?
[Projoy] Not an easel.
An artists palette?
(For Projoys sake, Im leaving it unclear if Im talking about one or multiple artists.)
[CdM] Not a palette.
I took a closer look at mine, and there are a few screws in it.
A wooden posable model thingy for artists to use to get human forms right?
[Phil] *applause* You have precisely guessed the words on the card! It is indeed a wooden posable model thingy for artists to use to get human forms right!
[Raak] Is there an official name for a WPMTfAtUtgHFR?
The simplest description I've found is an artists' manikin.
Here goes another one: ANIMAL, VEGETABLE & MINERAL
A cornet player dressed up (in natural fibres) as a pink fairy?
Is the animal element human?
[Raak] As the costume was polyester, your guess falls by the wayside, I'm afraid. Not a bad effort, but completely off the mark :-)
[Kim] Human? NO
Is the Animal alive?
[Rosie] Live animal? NO
Is it edible?
[GIII] Edible? NO
Does the whole thing occur naturally?
Part of an animal, eg fur?
[Kim] A natural occurrence? NO
[Rosie] Fur-esque? YES *Applause*
An item of clothing?
[Rosie] Confirmation that I was only referring to the animal element when answering your last question.
[Raak] Item of clothing? NO
Is bone involved?
[Raak] Bone involved? Not to my knowledge.
Contains leather?
[Rosie] Contains leather? YES *Some applause*
Can you put things into it?
[Kim] Can things be put into it? YES
A HAND-baaag?
A wallet?
A suitcase?
A leather tankard?
[Rosie] Handbag? NO
[GIII] Wallet? NO
[nights] suitcase? NO
[Raak] Leather tankard? NO
A large object, not normally moved?
[Rosie] Two questions for the price of one! A large object? YES Not normally moved? NO
Is it a piece of luggage?
[Raak] Piece of luggage? NO
Is it a piece of furniture?
An elephant's foot umbrella stand?
[Chalky] Piece of furniture? NO
[INJ] Nellie's brollies? NO
Used for transport?
A pair of clown shoes?
[INJ] Used for transport? YES *Loud applause*
[Raak] clown shoes? NO
Part of a means of transport?
[Rosie] Part of a means of transport? NO
A motor car?
A saddle?
A type of carriage?
A Surrey with a Fringe on Top?
Forgive the simulpost, but that was what I was actually thinking of.
[Chalky] A motor car? YES *More loud applause*
[Raak] Saddle? NO, see above
[INJ] Carriage or song from Oklahoma!? NO, see above
Are we trying to guess the make and model?
A Rolls Royce?
No, damn it. Please ignore the previous and replace with "A Morgan". Ta.
[Chalky] Make & Model? Yes please :-) *more applause*
[Dujon] Moggie? NO
[INJ] Good grief. I had been planning (since before this round began) "Surrey with a Fringe on Top" as my next AVMA subject.
Still in production?
English?
/British?
[INJ] In production? YES
[GIII] English/British? Hmmmm...British-built, but not owned (any more) *Audience gasps at how much information the usually-tight-lipped Phil is giving away*
Mini?
Is this a car that you own?
What me? Nosey?
[GIII] Mini? NO
[Chalky] My car? NO *Laughter from the audience*
Is it a single, specific car?
Luxury/High performance?
Yeah, yeah, I know that's two questions.
[Raak] single, specific car? NO, presuming you mean something like "Chitty Chitty Bang Bang" or "John Major's Nova", otherwise see Chalky's penultimate question.
[INJ] Luxury/high performance? YES on both counts *a little more applause*
Soft-top/convertible?
[GIII] Convertible? YES *a bit more applause*
Is it a Chevrolet (yes, the make them) Corvette?
[Red Wolf] Chevvy? NO, see Graham III's third last question.
Is it an Aston Martin DB9?
[Phil] Graham III's last question was if it was a soft-top/convertible. Corvettes do have that option, they are luxury and high performance, at which they are only beaten out by the Dodge Viper (flames to come from that, I'm sure). Even then, a 'Vette is still preferred.

The issue comes in that I forgot the British point 3 questions ago. See new guess above.

[RW] DB9? Fraid not, even though a friend of mine has one...the lucky (rich) swine. Btw, if you look closely, you'll see that I said "third last question" :-)
Bentley Continental GTC?
[GIII] Bentley? NO
Rolls Royce drophead coupe?
[GIII] Not a Roller either - not quite that de luxe
Is it an Aston Martin?
I admit, I missed that and can be blind at times. Forgive me, all. The logic behind the above question: [Phil] said that it wasn't the DB9, then that it wasn't a Bentley or a Rolls, but he never specifically said it wasn't an AM. So, it isn't as dumb a question as it might seem... I hope...
[RW} Nope, it's not any kind of Aston Martin.
Is it a Lotus of some kind?
I'm running out of marques. I am also struggling to find a niche for Lotus in the luxury class of vehicles.
[Dujon] Not a Lotus either. It's a very well known make of car, worldwide.
Bentley?
[Raak] Not a Bentley. Maybe my idea of luxury/high performance is not as high-spec as everyone else's, but the on-the-road price is about £70k
BMW 6-series convertible?
MG - Rover?
Jaguar?
[GIII] BMW? NO
[Chalky] MG-Rover? NO
[INJ] Jaguar? YES, dagnammit, YES! *rapturous applause dies off rapidly as audience remembers that the model is required too*
Jaguar XK 4.2 convertible
Well I bet there's an 'X' in there somewhere
Jaguar XK 4.2L convertible
Just a cheeky pedant's guess ;-)
Jaguar XKR 4.2L supercharged convertible
Although a more serious guess just to make sure all of the bases are covered ;-)
[INJ] Not that one
[GIII] Not that one either
[GIII take 2] YES, that one!
Gosh. That was exciting. well played GIIIIIIII
It was almost as exciting as a Reese's Peanut Butter Cup.
Goodness me, well there's a turn-up for the books. Let's try something Abstract.
Altogether now... a Human Construct?
Anarcho-syndicalism?
Come on, let's keep in time.
[Projoy] If by that you mean something dreamt up by a human being, then YES.
[Kim] Unionised chaos? NO
Does it begin with a 'P'?
Well, if Kim is going to steal my lines, I'll just have to take TUJ's
Did the idea originate before 1900?
[INJ] P? Ah, NO [Projoy] pre-1900? YES
Musical?
[Raak] YES! *applause*.
European?
After 1700?
[Kim] No
[Projoy] No
Is it American?
Prepare for a SPAM of 3
Is it British?
Is it Asian?
[Red Wolf 1] The USA didn't exist before 1700.
[Red Wolf 2] See above
[Red Wolf 3] NO.
A scale?
[Rosie] Interesting, but NO.
A particular piece of music?
[GIII] The Americas have been around for 100 million years or so, though.
Is it anything to do with North African drum rhythms?
[GIII] Sorry, I missed those... The Europeans have had records of the American continents, though, since the 11th century, thanks to the Vikings, and have been visited since about the 6th century, thanks to the Celts. American Indian music is noteworthy.
Is it specific to any continent?
A type of singing, chanting or other non-instrumental sound?
[CdM] Particular piece? YES
[CdM] To say yes to it being American would have been misleading. The Americas have existed for a very long time, however in common parlance 'America' means nothing but the USA.
[Red Wolf] Drumming? NO
[Projoy] YES, though see CdM's question above.
[Rosie] See answer to CdM.
But is it, as Rosie asks, an exclusively vocal piece?
[Projoy] It is performed as such now, though it was probably performed with instruments originally.
So, it originated in Africa?
(just to rule out Australasia/Oceania)
Wimoweh?
[Projoy] NO (you might want to look at my comment to CdM)
[Rosie] NO
Is it a Russian piece of music?
Latin American?
[Chalky] Russki? NO [Rosie] Latino? YES! *warm applause from the audience*
From before 1500?
An accompaniment to a dance?
La Folia?
does it begin with a 'w'?
Does it begin with a vowel?
Does it begin with anything?
Sorry, got called away...
[Projoy] No
[Rosie] No
[Raak] No
[Chalky] No and No, [CdM] YES!
[all] Apologies for the delay caused by a work and Christmas combo. I would suggest a line of questioning along the lines of who might have written it. Then Wikipedia will be of massive help...
Does it begin on the first beat of the bar?
[Rosie] In so far as there would have been bars (i.e. it begins on a stressed note), YES.
Is it considered the work of one author?
[Projoy] YES
A piece of sacred music?
[Raak] YES! *applause*
A masterpiece of Mexican polyphony?
[Raak] Masterpiece? Subjective of course, and not on the disc of that name. Mexican Polyphony? YES! *audience applauds, excited discussion*
Juan Gutiérrez de Padilla
(he only has 700 surviving pieces, so it should be easy to narrow it down if it is him)
[Projoy] YES! *applause*
The Missa ego flos campi
(or, in English, the absent selfhood of effeminate Flossie)
A la xácara xacarilla?
(Or in English, "To the Batmobile!")
[Raak] Thwack! Kapow! No, Robin.
Projoy: YES! The exact words on the card! *The audience go wild and bleat with delight*.
Well, that was a stroke. I'm much too ill at the moment to set one and remember it later, so perhaps I could defer to someone else? Raak, maybe?
Get well soon PJ x
Get well soon! Ok, if I'm on, then the next one is MINERAL.
Human-made?
Not human-made.
Unique?
[Projoy] Best of health to you!
Not unique.
A geographical feature?
Not a geographical feature.
A substance?
Not necessarily psychoactive.
Not a substance.
Bigger than a phonebox?
Feeling thick again - never heard of de Padilla or his work :-(
Found in caves?
[Phil] Apologies for that - it was a bit obscure, but I thought it was hunt-downable, even if you hadn't heard of the composer in the first place. He's not well known outside the world of choral music, but worth exploring if you like the genre.
[Phil] Could be larger or smaller than a phonebox.
[Graham] Not found in caves.
The name of a continuous substance - e.g. "rock"?
[GIII/Phil] It was definitely huntdownable, since I'd never heard of him/it either until I googled "Mexican Polyphony". :)
A household object?
[Projoy] Not the name of a substance.
[irach] Not a household object.
Connected with weather?
[Rosie] It could well be connected with the weather.
Is it liquid?
[GIII/Projoy] I'm sure I could've found the answer if I'd tried (which I didn't) - I just felt thick that I'd never heard of him.
A flood?
[Phil] Not liquid, hence...
[Rosie] Not a flood.
Is it normally a gas in the atmosphere?
[RW] Not a gas in the atmosphere.
A gas to be found in outer space?
Snow in some form?
[Projoy] Not a gas to be found anywhere.
[Rosie] Not any form of snow.
Is it solid?
[Phil] YES, solid.
Is this found all over the world?
PJ] Hope you're feeling better
[I] Not found all over the world. Not at all!
A meteorite?
Volcanic origin?
[Phil] *applause* Not a meteorite.
[Rosie] Not volcanic.
Something of non-terrestrial origin?
An asteroid, perhaps?
[Phil] *Cheers and more cheering* Non-terrestrial, yes, and an asteroid.
Is it a single object of uncertain size? (cf phonebox)
[CdM] Not a single object.
Tectites?
[Rosie] Not tectites.
Minor Planets?
[Phil] Is that different from an asteroid?
[Phil] If "minor planets" is a subset of asteroids, it's the wrong subset.
A meteor?
C-type Asteroids?
[Rosie] *excited murmurs* Not a meteor.
[Projoy] Not C-type.
Are they found as trojan asteroids?
Are they found as belt asteroids?
Are they M-type asteroids?
I know, bad form for three questions...
[RW] None of them are trojans.
[RW] I'm not sure if they count as belt asteroids or not.
[RW] Not M-type, although individual examples might or might not be.
The moons of Jupiter?
[Chalky] Not the moons of Jupiter. Asteroids, remember.
Members of a particular asteroid family?
NEAs (Near Earth Asteroids)?
Hilda asteroids?
[I] (pause to google the precise definition of an asteroid family) No. Hence...
[C] Hilda Ogden? No.
[P] *loud applause* Yes, they are all NEAs (but not all NEAs are of this particular type).
An Amor-type object?
Chanson d'Amor
PHAs (Potentially Hazardous Asteroids)?
[Phil] *more applause* They are indeed potentially hazardous, but that is not quite the definition of the class on the card.
Apollo Asteroids?
[Phil] Not the Apollos.
Ahem - an Amor-type object?
Aten-type?
Going to have to dig deeper if it's not one of those three.
[Phil] Doesn't begin with A.
[Phil] [Rosie & Phil]
An extinct comet?
[I] Not an extinct comet.
The earth's moons?
[Phil] Not the earth's moons (I thought we only had one, unless Cruithne and the dust clouds at the Trojan points count).
Damocloids?
Despite the question mark - that really was me :-)
Earth-crossing asteroids?
[Chalky] Haemorrhoids on the point of fatally bursting? No.
[Rosie] (An asteroid crashes into the theatre, vaporising everything for twenty miles in every direction and throwing up enough dust to begin an ice age. A million years later intelligent cockroaches emerge to build a new world.) Bullseye!
Oh drat! Aten + Appollo = Earth-crossers...so near, and yet so far. Still, I've learnt more about asteroids in the last two days, than in the previous 40 years.
(Phil) Good heavens, are you 40?
This one is ABSTRACT, with ANIMAL connections. (Not cockroaches with HNC Building Practice).
[Rosie] Yes - and so is Mrs Phil on Saturday.
Is the animal connection human?
(Duj) Human it is.
Is it, therefore, a human construct?
(Projoy) Not strictly a deliberate construct but an off-the-cuff answer would be YES.
Would the abstract then be something which humans learned rather than invented?
(Dujon) You could certainly say that. *applause*
Mathematics-related?
(CdM) Nothing to do with maths.
Was it discovered by scientists?
(Raak) Not discovered by scientists.
Does this have to do with the skies?
By that I mean anything above terra firma.
(Dujon) Nothing to do with the skies.
Is there a religious connection?
(Quendalon) No religious connection at all.
Is this a state of mind?
(Chalky) Not a state of mind.
Is it connected to language?
(Chalky) *prolonged applause* It certainly is.
Is it A language?
[Just me an' you at the mo, Rosers]
(Chalky) Not A Language *some scattered applause*
Keep 'em coming!
A 'part' of language?
I'm trying Rosie - have even done a pub quiz [which we won - wahay] and come back....[Where IS everyone?]
(Chalky) Yes. *more vigorous applause*. (I wish you'd put a comma after your first two words because it reminds me that I haven't quite got the stamina I had 30 yrs ago.)
Specific to the English language?
A smart-arse reply?
(CdM) Not specific to the English language.
(Irouléguy) Try again. :-)
A grammatical principle?
Onomatopoeia?
(Graham III) Not a grammatical principle.
(Quendalon) Not onomatopoeia.

A different aspect of language needs to be considered.

Poetry?
Is it to do with writing?
Storytelling?
(Bigsmith) Not poetry.
(Red Wolf) Definitely nothing to do with writing.
(Graham III) Not storytelling.
Is it usually spoken (rather than written)?
Are we seeking some form of cant?
An accent?
A dialect?
Is it a style of language (e.g. sarcasm)?
(Iroluléguy) Yes.
(Dujon) Not cant.
(CdM) Yes! *vigorous applause* Not quite the words on the card.
(Tshauki) Not really, but *some applause*
(Phil) Not a style of language.
(Irg) You know who I mean. Dreadful sorry.
Received Pronunciation?
No, wait, it's not specific to English, is it...
A foreign accent?
Does this occur in all languages?
(CdM-1)*audience laughter* No!
(CdM-2) Not foreign.
(Irouléguy) Almost certainly every language has this.
An idiolect?
Slang?
An ecolect?
A regional accent?
Ayup, chuck, someone's gorrit. A REGIONAL ACCENT it is, and CHALKY is the winner!
By 'eck - am reet choofed

Thanks Mr Rosie.
I shall now gleefully plunge into my chairpersonship with a tantalising
A B S T R A C T / M I N E R A L with A N I M A L connections ......

The Lascaux paintings?
Is the way the subject is formatted on the laser scoreboard significant?
[Rosie] Bzzzzzt Repetition!
Huh. I don't know what went wrong there...
[Raak] Cave scribblings? NO
[INJ] Notable display? NO

[CdM - was that meant to be a link to a similar subject for guessing - a couple of years back?]
Is the animal connection human?
[Kim] Human? YES
Something inhabited by humans?
Is it a work of art?
A building?
[Quendalon] Inhabited by peeps? NO
[Raak] A work of art? NO ]
[Rosie] Building? NO
A one-word answer?
[Tuj] One word? YES
Unique?
Would this, Chalky, be a construction variously referred to as a monument/astronomical observatory/religious site?
[Quendalon] One of a kind? NO
[Dujon] Well now, Duj - now I have interpreted the thrust of your question - I feel I can quite categorically reply IN THE NEGATIVE :-)
Graffiti?
Specific to a particular culture?
[Chalky] Yes. Rosie set exactly the same subject a while back. Together with Raak's repetition of "alarm clock", this sets me wondering if the time is coming to put this game to rest awhile.
(Also, pace Rosie's answer, I'm prepared to bet that some of the Papua New Guinea languages do not have regional accents!)
[Rosie] Graffiti? NO but ...*murmers from audience*
[CdM] Culturally specific? NO

Re: this game. Correct me if I'm wrong, but is it the only really competitive guessing game over the 3 servers? Also it's a flagship game for MC5, is genuinely mind-expanding and happens to be a personal favourite. So I would hate to see it go. However, if others feel the same, I would naturally, go with the majority. :-)
[Chalky] That was more of a random musing than a vote. I love this game as well, but it is striking that people are forgetting the subjects that they themselves have set in the past.
Poetry?
[Phil] Poetry? NO

[CdM] An indicator that regardless of the trillions of potential choices, l'idée fixe has more power?
An inscription of some kind?
(CdM) re - PNG local accents - I won't argue (for once).
[Rosie] Inscription? NO
Is this a natural phenomenon?
[Rosie] A natural phenomenon? NO
Is it symbolic?
[Rosie] Symbolic? No - not really. In fact - NO
Does it involve words?
[Graham III] Involve words? NO
Does it have to do with sound?
[Red Wolf] To do with sound? NO
is the abstract/mineral something built or constructed?
Is the mineral metal?
Peak Oil?
Anything to do with transport?
Nit necessarily steam trains.
BUGGER! Nit = not.
[Irouléguy] Built or constructed? SORT OF - but, then again, not in the way I think you mean
[Phil] Mineral metal? NO ... it could be but I wouldn't like to mislead you.
[Raak] Peak Oil? NO
[Rosie] Transport? NIET
Is it bigger than a house?
[Raak] Bigger than a house? NO ... not normally, although it could be but I wouldn't like to mislead you :-)
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