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AVMA Take 2
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Yes, it's another round of that classic guessing game - Animal, Vegetable, Mineral, Abstract [or any combination thereof]. This effort - '03/'04 should address any queries, but then again, may just serve to confuse and baffle which some might say is the point of the game. Patience, integrity and a decent search engine may be useful ....
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The Union Flag (Union Jack)?
Union Flag? No.
Is it normally attached to clothing?
A designer label?
Normally attached to clothing? Most often, yes. applause
Designer label? Yes, broadly defined (though not exactly). applause
a care label?
A logo?
Care label? No.
A logo? Yes. applause
The Nike Symbol?
Nike? Yes! The words on the card are actually "The Nike Swoosh", but that's close enough. *hands branded baton to Projoy*
Oh dear, that was a bit of a lurker's victory. Nevermind...
VEGETABLE/MINERAL/ABSTRACT
A natural product?
Whaddya meeeen Never mind? I'm furious, as always.
Begins with a P?
[Rosie] There, there. Mine usually don't take long to get... A natural product? NO.
[Tuj] Begins with a P? YES
Yes!!
(no question)
Smaller than a phone box?
Oh alright then.
[Tuj] Smaller than a phone box? YES
A Mr. Potato Head?
[Raak] Kartoffelkopf? NEIN
Is the vegetable wood?
Is it mass produced?
The peck of pickled peppers that Peter Piper picked?
[Ig] Wood? PROBABLY
[Ink] Mass-produced? I DOUBT IT
[CdM] The sum of stewed squash stolen by some silly sod? NO
Primarily produced for artistic, rather than practical, reasons?
[INJ] I'm not sure there's anything other than a misleading answer to that other than IT DEPENDS.
Is it found in the home?
[Raak] Found in the home? NOT NORMALLY
Does music come into this?
[Chalky] Music connection? NO
Smaller than a shoe-box?
[Ig] Smaller than a shoe-box? NO
Found on a ship?
[Raak] On a ship? NO
Is it street furniture?
[Rosie] Street Furniture, YES *applause, although there are some dissenting voices*
[INJ] On further reflection, there are two separate answers to the "artistic, rather than practical" question. One is an unequivocal YES, the other is a tentative NO.
Festive ornamentation of some sort?
[Raak] Festive Ornamentation? NO
Parking meters?
[Ig] Parking meters? NO (but a sensitive ear can make out the sound of one hand clapping)
A shelter of some kind?
[Rosie] A shelter? YEAH, I GUESS
Bus stop?
[ir] Bus stop, NOPE
A bench?
[ir] Bench, NOPE
Parking garage?
[ir] Parking garage, NOPE (don't forget - is smaller than a phone box)
parasol?
[INJ] Parasol, NO * a slight chill breeze wafts from the audience *
A Parking/No parking sign
(no) parking sign, NOPE
A pissoir?
[Rosie] Pissoir? NOPE
[all] I know it seems like it's been narrowed down quite a bit, but critical information about the answer has yet to be unearthed, hence most of these guesses missing.
A café umbrella?
[Raak] Café Umbrella? NOPE
Specific to one culture/country?
Is the shelter for people?
Park bench?
And it begins with P!
Is the vegetable wood?
[INJ] Specific to one culture/country? NO, NOT REALLY
[Ig] Shelter for people? SORT OF (it's not for any other species either)
[Tuj] Park bench, NOPE
[Raak] Wood? PROBABLY, BUT MIGHT NOT BE
Is it put there by the local authority?
[Rosie] Local Authority, NO
(put where, btw?)
Would it normally be found on the UK pavement as opposed to the US pavement?
[INJ] UK/US? NO. Wouldn't normally be found in either place.
Is it found in a particular type of location?
Some kind of fencing?
A pier?
[Rosie] Particular type of location? YES and NO. The most helpful answer is NO.
[Tuj] Fencing? NO
[Ig] Pier? NO
[Rosie] Actually, it could be that the most helpful answer is YES, come to think of it. Sorry, not wishing to be perverse, but there's still something you don't yet know about this thing that, one you have found it out, would enable me to give much less equivocal answers.
A pier?
I am so blind - apols for such blatant repitition
Is it fictional?
Pillarbox?
[Phil] apology accepted :)
[Tuj] Fictional? YES *relieved applause and cheering*
[Phil] Pillarbox? NO, although the notion of taking shelter in a pillarbox is amusing me as I type.
From a book?
Pfff blimey. Can't believe we hadn't questioned the abstract sooner.
[Tuj] From a book? YES
One specific, individual thing?
[Raak] Specific, individual? YES
[Projoy] It's only "sort of" a shelter for people, so I thought it might be a shelter for things, that people use. But, you could shelter one hand at a time in one :-)
Is the book science fiction?
[Raak] SF? NO.
A porch?
[Raak] Porch, NO.
A Priesthole?
(only they have them in non-fiction too, but it's all I can think of)
[Phil] Priesthole? NOPE
Is it a 20th century book?
[Ig] C20th book? YES
Is the book set, broadly speaking, in the present day (as opposed to being obviously historical fiction or obviously set in the future)?
[CdM] Broadly present-day, YES
(there is a case for a NO answer, but that would be a bit obnoxious)
Are there multiple instances of this one specific thing? (I'm trying to reconcile "specific individual thing" with "not specific to one culture")
[CdM] Multiple instances? NO (there's no especial reason there couldn't be, but only one is mentioned - there's nothing about the one instance encountered that is (particularly) specific to one culture)
Is the book set in a recognisable real location or locations?
(I'm making up for all the questions I didn't ask earlier.)
[CdM] Real/recognisable location? NO (and YES, but mostly NO)
Would the book be considered as basically for children?
[CdMaddendum] Which is to say in terms of "recognisable", the answer is definitely NO, and in terms of "real", it's MOSTLY NO.
[INJ] Basically for children? YES *applause*
In a Harry Potter book?
[INJ] Harry Potter? NO.
In a Narnian chronicle?
[CdM] I'm not that far back in the closet. NO. ;-)
In a Philip Pullman book?
[Ig] Philip Pullman? NOPE (even though he begins with P twice!)
Book from the last 50 years?
[Tuj] From the last 50 Years, YES
A Tolkien book?
Is the writer British?
Pub sign?
Pinocchio?
Just one book, or a series?
[Phil] Tolkien? NO
[Inkspot] British? NO
[Tuj] Pub sign? NO
[ir] Pinocchio, NO
[Ig] Just one book? YES
Da Recap
So, it's a fictional, single, individual object which is smaller than a phone-box, larger than a shoe-box and appears in a one-off C20th children's novel by a non-British author, which is mostly set in unreal locations, published some time in the last fifty years. It may be described as "street furniture" (with some potential for controversy) and The Answer begins with a 'P'. More dubious are the details of what it's made of (probably wood), where it is most likely to be found, and whether it is likely to be mass-produced (unlikely, IMO). I won't go thru all the things it's not, but will note that some people will have heard of it, others will probably require google.
French?
[INJ] French? NO
European?
OK, let's be systematic about this.
Phantom Tollboth?
And can I just say that, if that isn't right, then it ought to be.
[INJ] European, NO...
[CdM] Phantom Tollbooth? YES!! *collects checkpoint fee and hands baton back to CdM*
Never heard of it, nor will many others, thus excluding them from the game. Google it? What do you type into Google? "Something I have never heard of". Go! This is by no means the worst example of an inappropriate subject, there being many of them so arcane that you just give up, bored, knowing that eventually some clever clogs will winkle out the answer. I could retaliate, of course, if I ever win again. It will be a steam engine. Not just any old steam engine. Oh dear me no. A particular type and not only that, a particular class. And not just any old loco of that class but a particular engine. And will it be notable in any way? Not necessarily. Wouldn't that be clever? The point I am making is that this game has departed a long way from the original concept, which was conducted live and necessarily needed maybe unusual but universally-known subjects. It needs to stop being a research project or a showcase for clever boys and return to its more modest origins.
Ditto, never heard of it :-(
[Rosie] Oh, rubbish. If we stuck to obvious stuff, this game would have run out of steam much earlier. I enjoyed finding out about, for example, Bobrikov, set by Néa earlier in the game. I'd never heard of him, but that hardly excluded me from the game (in fact it was me who dug up the answer after about 20 minutes' research).
Besides, anyone who hasn't heard of the Phantom Tollbooth has just had the good fortune to discover it. It is one of the classics of literature and they should read it at once (preferably in an edition with the original Jules Feiffer cartoons).
Bobrikov, and Bluebeard (which I found through Google) were good - difficult, and involved learning something new, but they were relatively "googlable". Luckily, the Phantom Bluetooth appears to be well enough known for someone to get it, it's just us grumpy old men that have never heard of it ;-)
Lets move on and work the next one out :-)
(Projoy) There is an absolutely huge number of subjects that are universally known. The skill is in picking one that is a little off-beat and needs a little imagination to guess. That's what the original Animal, Vegetable and Mineral was about. Turning it into a research project is a negation of the original idea. I have no interest whatever in which particular species of South American lizard, or which character from some science fiction novel the questioner is thinking of. That is just so nerdy. And boring! It's meant to be a game. Time for another extended absence from this one, I feel.
[Rosie] Please don't deprive us of your presence from this game. Surely now your opinions have been aired and taken into account by the rest of us there should be less of a problem? I'm in the "never heard of it" camp for the last one, but that happens every now and then - and I'm sure it does for everyone. Trying to come up with subjects every single time that every member of a multi-national group of people from a fair age range have heard of wouldn't be too easy. Yes, if there happens to be another subject soon that the majority of people consider inappropriate we can have this kind of discussion, but shall we just get on with things for now?
[CdM] By the way, no pressure on choosing the next topic ;)
(Tuj) That's very kind, and I actually enjoy the game, yes really, but only up to the point where I reckon the answer must be something I've never heard of, at which I just switch off and hope for something better next time. OK, I'll put in some questions then, if you insist. :-)
[Tuj] Well, I was thinking about picking a particular steam engine...
[Rosie] I understand where you are coming from -- halfway through the last AVMA I remember thinking "well, if this is from a Philip Pullman book I might as well give up now." At the same time this game, like so many that we play, is different from its antecedent, and I think this is a good thing, not a bad thing. This online version is played using google from time to time, and that does open us up to more obscure topics. As to whether Projoy's particular choice was too obscure, I am inclined to think not (but then, I did know the answer). The answer was the title to the book, not something from within the book, and I do think the book is acknowledged as at least a minor classic of children's literature -- maybe not in the A.A. Milne or Lewis Carroll or C.S. Lewis league, but comparable to perhaps the works of Roald Dahl or Arthur Ransome. Like Tuj, though, I would urge you to keep playing. On which note,
ABSTRACT
A human construct?
Human construct? Yes is the least misleading answer.
Does it have religious connotations?
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