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AVMA Take 2
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Yes, it's another round of that classic guessing game - Animal, Vegetable, Mineral, Abstract [or any combination thereof]. This effort - '03/'04 should address any queries, but then again, may just serve to confuse and baffle which some might say is the point of the game. Patience, integrity and a decent search engine may be useful ....
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[Dazed] Millions? Probably not in the UK
Is this group then specific to the UK?
This thing that they are, one might have to say, fans of, are they practitioners of it?
Do these people go out of the house to indulge their interest?
Would you expect many of the Morniverse's inhabitants to be among these people?
Would many of them gather together in one place to experience this thing for which they have a penchant?
... sorry - been busy
[Dazed] specific to UK? No
[Raak]practitioners? In a manner of speaking, Yes.
[Rosie] Out of house indulgence? No - not necessarily
[Irouléguy] Crescenters? Can't say I know them all well enough, but No *chuckles*
[Kim] Gathering? Some may, some may not.
When somebody gets the right answer, will this site become NSFW?
*laughs out loud*
[CdM] I only practise safe chairwomanship
Would this shared interest be considered risqué in a polite society?
Does it involve any aspect of procreation?
[Dazed] Risqué? No
[irach] Procreation? No

... so that's eliminated any saucy shenanegans :-)
However, both questions are the type of questions that need to be asked.

Are particular types of clothing involved?
[Irouléguy] Clothing? No
Would most people say these people are anoraks?
[Rosie] Anoraks? No
Does this shared interest require any specialist equipment?
Does the shared interest require ambulation of any kind?
Are there roughly equal numbers of both sexes involved?
Does it involve the playing of a game?
[Dazed] specialist equipment? Equipment isn't really the right word, but it certainly requires a certain something to belong to this group
[irach] ambulation? Not really [see Rosie previous question]
[Rosie] equal numbers? I should think so
[Raak] game playing? No

CLUE: The word 'hobby' got a thumbs down, if you read back. This isn't an 'interest' either. It is something that a certain group of people have in common. 'Fan' [as in fanatical] and 'penchant' have both been given a cursory nod ..

Is it connected with either eating or drinking?
[Dazed] Yes! At last :-) * audience wakes up and overcompensates by whooping and hollering *
Wine connoisseurs?
Are they linked by food from a particular part of the world?
[Raak] Wine Connoisseurs? They may well be [but that's not the word on the card]
[Irouléguy] Linked? Food? Part of World? No, No and Thrice No
Alcoholics?
Gourmands of any kind?
Is the "certain something" that is required inherent in the individual?
Vegetarians?
Four very good questions, but only one is correct:

Well done Raak - Alcoholics is the right answer. Over to you ...

I'm off to the Worldcon on Wednesday, but I'm sure you'll get this before then.

MINERAL

Something made by humans?
A natural phenomenon?
[I] Yes.
[K] No.
Uses electricity?
[Rosie] Yes.
Used in the preparation of food?
[nights] No.
Used for recreation?
Normally used in the home?
[irach] Can be.
[Rosie] No.
Is it noisy when in operation?
Can it be used to get from one place to another?
Bigger than one metre cubed?
Ever used in the office?
[irach] No.
[RS] Yes.
[Chalky] No.
[irach] Yes.
Can it be used for communications?
[irach] No.
Is its primary use as a means of transport?
[I] Yes! (applause)
A mode of transportation that's used in the office? (you said above it WAS used in the office). Or primarily to get you to work at the office?
[irach] You asked "Ever used in the office?" so the answer was yes, because I've heard of it happening. But that's an unusual use.
An electric scooter?
An electric wheelchair?
[I] Erm...not entirely sure whether "scooter" would cover this or not.
[R] No.
A Segway?
I was going to post this guess on Friday, but thought that RS's comment would have earned applause if it was right... however, it seems to fit with some of the later Q and A...
[CdM] Yes, a Segway.
OK, an easy one: MINERAL
The new planet 'Xena'?
not that easy
warrior princess? No.
Man-made?
Is it a specific object?
Man-made? No.
Specific object? No.
A type of rock?
A present from Brighton? No.
Is it a solid in its normal state?
Solid in normal state? No. *applause*
Is it bigger than a phone box?
Given that it is not a specific object, the question does not really make sense. However, in the individual instances in which it is normally encountered, it is smaller than a phone box.
Is it mobilel?
A snowman?
mobile? If you mean can it be easily moved, the answer is yes.
snowman? No.
A snowflake?
Is it fluid?
Does "not a specific object" mean "not a named object", so it could be "a mountain" but not "The Matterhorn" even though a mountain could be classed as a specific object?
Is this a type of metal (e.g. mercury)
?
snowflake? No.
fluid? Yes.
clarification of 'not a specific object'? The words on the card are a fairly generic term that refer to a category or class (using those terms loosely) of which there are many different instances, some of which are named. In terms of your example, it is more like the answer being "mountains". Which isn't the answer.
metal? No. silence? No.
A spring?
boingggg? No. *substantial applause from audience, together with stamping of feet and a chant of  "Ro-SIE! Ro-SIE! Ro-SIE!"*
Is the answer the container of a fluid?
Water?
container? No, although the 'specific instances' that I referred to above do involve containers.
water? *applause* Water is one of the words on the card. It is not a sufficient answer, however.
Would the water in question be considered potable?
potable? Yes. *some applause*
Bottled water?
God knows what the audience will do if this is right. I'm a quiet sort of bloke really, you know. :-)
Mineral water?
Soda water?
Water-ed down drinks?
and the winner is...
...Irouléguy. MINERAL WATER it is. I just wanted to be sure there were no disputes about the AVMA classification this time.
Wahay! Nice team-work there, everyone. I'm away after Friday lunchtime for the weekend, so another easy one:
MINERAL
Man-made?
Solid?
Man-made? No
Solid? No is the most useful answer, though there could be some discussion about this
Is it a terrestrial object?
Terrestrial? Yes Object? Yes, but see qualification above
The earth's crust?
*the audience cheers, hoots, stamps and lets off fireworks, and several shouts of "RO-sie, RO-sie" are heard from the balcony* No
Atmospheric particles?
The earth's mantle?
Atmospheric particles? No
The earth's mantle *the audience pull shawls round their shoulders, button up cardigans and tighten scarves* No
A tectonic plate?
Let's see what this volatile lot will do with this one.
Molten lava? (It is not solid, but does solidify soon after emergence from the nether regions, so there could be some discusion regarding its physical form.)
Mineral-laden hot springs?
A tectonic plate? *a low approving approving murmur rises from the audience* No
Molten lava? *the audience passes around Damart catalogues as the ushers attempt to turn up the radiators* No
Mineral-laden hot springs *"We could use some of those here", think the audience* No
A continental shelf?
À la Lara Croft, he muses, with a silly grin.
Magma?
Tsunami?
An Earthquake?
A Glacier?
An Iceberg?
A continental shelf? *the audience muses on the fact that there are about 21,500 Google hits for "Lara Croft" and "the answer"* No
Magma? No
Tsunami? *the audience seeks diversion in a spirited discussion of the correct plural of 'tsunami'* No
An earthquake? No
A glacier? No
An iceberg *the audience nods knowingly at the ironic appropriateness of Chalky and irach's moves*

Looking back, I may have mis-directed people with the answer to the solid question. Perhaps a better answer would be "Yes, partly."
Do we want a clue?
Antarctica?
Antarctica? *the audience sits up straight, puts away their papers, Sudoku puzzles and knitting* No, but in some ways the closest answer yet
The ocean?
The North or South Pole ?
The Arctic Ocean?
[irach] that's TWO guesses - very naughty!
Well then, North Pole?
The South Pole?
[Chalky] Nothing wrong with irach's question -- it has a yes-or-no answer, and if the answer were yes, then it would simply be all fingers on the buzzers to guess which one!
Oh, and if I am right, I hereby transfer my win to irach.
The ocean? No
The North or South Pole? *the audience giggle quietly* No
The Arctic Ocean? No

I'm with CdM on irach's question - people do bend the one-question rule (me included), and a single question can anyway turn into a mutiple answer (see "terrestial object" above).

Chalky has now got the geographically closest answer, but in other, more important ways, irach is still closest.

I am going away this afternoon, and work means I'm unlikely to be able to play more than once again before I go. Any volunteers to take over as quizmaster/mistress? Email me at pubsalesatbaafdotorgdotuk .
No e-mails, so...for your safety and convenience, this game will not contain any further replies from me until Monday (maybe) or Tuesday (more likely. Have a good weekend, everyone

Parting thought - the speed of this game is somehow appropriate.

Parting clue - there's a coincidental connection with both Bob Dylan and organised religion.
Glacier?
The North Magnetic Pole?
Well, of course a b&b in St Austell will have a broadband connection - silly of me to assume otherwise

Glacier? No
The North magnetic pole? *the audience breaks into small groups to find any connection between Bob Dylan, organised religion and the north pole, magnetic or otherwise, but fails to reach any conclusions, rejecting the theory of the small group arguing for a metaphysical interpretation of "Quinn the mighty Eskimo".* No
The Greenland Icecap?
Does this have a direct relationship to air movement?
The Greenland icecap? *the audience wonders if their earlier tumultuous reaction to one of Rosie's moves has perhaps been overlooked* No. Direct relationship to air movement? Hmm...perhaps Rosie can shed more light on that once the answer's been revealed. Locally, yes, almost certainly; more generally, don't know.
Anything to do with drifts?
Drifts? (snow or continental?) Either way, no.
Auroro australis?
A volcano?
Aurora australis? No.
A volcano? *considerable applause* No.
fergawdssakeRosie - guess the damn thing!
Well, I'm FIIK, m'dear. The quizmaster has turned it into his own show and the audience are pissed.
The Arctic ice sheet?
Not being clever when it comes to Bob Dylan and religious sects I'm probably well adrift.
The Canadian Archipelago?
The Arctic ice sheet? No
The Canadian archipelago? No.

On present progress, it doesn't look like pure guesswork is going to get there - time for more general questions, perhaps? And another clue?
Is it an oilfield?
Geysers?
An oilfield? No
Geysers? No
Is the liquid water?
Deep-sea volcanic (hydrothermal) vents?
*yawns*
Liquid water? What liquid? There is some liquid present, but it's not really the defining characteristic. And yes, it's water.
Deep-sea volcanic vents? No
*yawns* *some applause* An apt description (of both game and answer)
By the way - what IS the 'earth's crust?'
[Irouléguy] I'm usually pretty hopeless at these geographical minerally ones so I leave them to more worthy participants, which I guess doesn't help much. Trouble is, if these posers are not guessed within 3 days, the game tends to lose its momentum. It is now Day 8 of this one so perhaps a chairman's summary of the positives might help? Then a clue?
It is Iceland?
Is it specifically in either the north or southern hemispere?
Chalky] Fair points all, though I have been trying to steer people away from the more detailed minerally answers (and I was away for most of three days). It's really not obscure - I feel sure that everyone will have heard of it.

Summary - it's terrestial, partly solid, sort of an object. (Those are the answers which I think have caused people to go astray, but it's problematic because of what exactly "it" is. Let's say that "the answer" is defined by solid objects.
There's a strong connection to the earth's crust (which is just the top bit of the earth itself -between 5 and 65km thick), and specific geographical features have got strong applause. It's NOT - man-made, either of the Poles, Antarctica, a tectonic plate, an oilfield, a continental shelf, a volcano, the Canadian archipelago, the Greenland icecap (or any other form of ice).
Clues 1) It's very aptly named; 2) it has a university named after it; 3) over four million people went there last year.

Iceland? No
Is it specifically in either the north or southern hemisphere? Yes, the northern.
Is the name metaphorical? eg "The roof of the world", "The home of the blizzard" etc, etc.
Is its location in Northern Europe?
Is the suffix or word "land" part of its name/identity?
Metaphorical name? No, if anything the reverse
Northern Europe? No
Is the suffix or word "land" part of its name/identity? *cheering, the audience all put their hands to their ears as through participating in charades* No
Is it in Nothh America?
...that should read "North America"
North America? *the orchestra strikes up "My country, 'tis of thee" as the audience jump up and down in anticipation* YES!
A part of the U.S.?
A National Park or part thereof?
The Grand Canyon ? ( It is in North America, there IS a Grand Canyon University, there is a lot of earth's crust to see there, there is some liquid-the Colorado among other forms found there, it sure does fit the bill).
[If the above IS the answer I would argue its classification as purely "Mineral" though, as the flora and fauna are also an integral part of the Grand Canyon as a whole].
*exhausted, the audiience can do nothing but sigh in pleasure* We have a winner - it is THE GRAND CANYON! Purely mineral? Not sure about irach's argument, but I'll think about it.
Anyway, the baton finally gets passed on - take it away, irach!
[Irouleguy] Thanks.! What was the Organized religion connection though? Bob Dylan I think I know.
Here goes. Well, its MINERAL once again.
[irach] hmmmm - hope it's snappier than the last one :-)
[Iroulé] GCanyon - classification, perhaps Mineral with Vegetable [and possibly Animal] connections?
Is it man made?
I have never seen a more self-indulgent and comprehensively misleading set of comments as in the last AVMA. The Grand Canyon has no more to do with the earth's crust than has the Vale of Evesham. It's a surface feature FFS. So why did the audience wet themselves, generally an indication that one has very nearly hit the bull?
[Chalky] Not man made.
Sorry.. [Inkspot] Not man made.
It is a geographical feature?
Call me pedantic, but I would argue that the Grand Canyon is composed entirely of air.
Chalky] Possibly - but then you'd have to apply that to practically every place or geological formation. Would that definition help you to get Everest, for instance?

Rosie] I may have misunderstood what I Googled - I'm no scientist. But this is from the GC National Park's website: The Canyon’s mile-high walls display a largely undisturbed cross section of the Earth’s crust extending back some two billion years.
from http://www.nps.gov/grca/pphtml/subnaturalfeatures14.html
and lots of sites talk about the GC being made by upheavals in the earth's crust, so that was the basis of my reaction. I'm sorry if it was misleading, and you're right about the self-indulgent bit - sorry again.

Kim] Well, that was why I was unsure about the answers to "solid" and "object". But it can't be all air - what about the floor or the sides of the canyon?

move] Is there just one of it?
[Kim} No. Not a geographical feature. [Irouleguy] There are more than one of these.
Is it a weather phenomenon?
(Irouléguy) Talk of the earth's crust made me think the answer was something to do with the material of the earth well below the surface whereas the Grand Canyon (and Cheddar Gorge) were gouged out by running water, i.e. surface erosion. Not to worry. :-)
[Rosie] No.
Is it metal?
[Irouléguy] Yes!
[Chalky] Not metallic per se, though there may sometimes be metal salts or ions embedded within it.
A precious stone?
{Rosie] No.
Is an individual one of these bigger than an elephant?
Chalky] OK2
A component of a man-made object such as Stonehenge?
[Irouleguy] Generally it is considerably larger than an elephant.
[Rosie] No, it's not possible to make any man-made object from it/them using any known contemporary technology.
An asteroid?
Or, more specifically, a meteor (or even more specifically, one or more Perseid meteors)
FWIW, I'll come to Irouléguy's defence here: (i) I think the categorization of the GC as mineral is entirely reasonable, since the flora and fauna are not an essential part of the Canyon; (ii) I think the positive response to the earth's crust was also reasonable (although I agree that the audience went a bit over the top), since a "no" would have been a more misleading answer; (iii) "self-indulgent" is an unfairly harsh term, given that he was just injecting some humor.
(CdM) Agree on (i), not on (ii); (iii) is more a matter of taste. BTW a meteor the size of an elephant would fall to earth and cause a lot of damage and would then be classed as a meteorite. Can't be that, but we'll see.
[Rosie] Not an asteroid or meteorite [CdM] Not a meteor, Perseid or otherwise. (However, the audience sits up in rapt attention, biting its nails in great anticipation of the next guess. Not quite cigar yet, but close).
A comet?
[Rosie] You are absolutely right about the elephant, of course.
[CdM} A Comet ? YES!!! Congratulations! How spatial! What a brilliant win! The tail end of this guessing game was great! Here's to many more, the sky is the limit! The baton is passed, so take it away...
[CdM} A Comet ? YES!!! Congratulations! How spatial! What a brilliant win! The tail end of this guessing game was great! Here's to many more wins, the sky is the limit! The baton is passed, so take it away...
[Irouleguy] Wouldn't that be like saying that a hole in the ground comprises not only the hole but also the ground around the hole? I think the GC is just a big hole.
All right, let's get back into the ethereal world of the ABSTRACT.
(with ANIMAL connections)
The bee's knees?
(or should I move that apostrophe?)
Nope. Nor the cat's pyjamas, or a dog's dinner. However, the audience applauds for the fact that the answer is indeed of the form: Definite article + 2 words.
Is the answer of the form "The + animal's + part of animal"?
No. But since I am feeling generous, I will tell you that the answer is of the form: "The + part of animal + something that is not an animal at all".
The skin of one's teeth? ...and thank you, though even I think I was being self-indulgent.
Kim] Yes. If the GC's just a great big hole, what defines where the hole ends?
The heart's desire?
(CdM) Useful generosity. :-)
The heart of the matter?
The foot of the stairs?
The brains of the operation?
Is the something that is not an animal at all an abstract noun?
[CdM] So what if there's more than one bee?
Or rather, why is it just one bee? I suppose I'm just hoping someone round here happens to know a lot about the phrase...
The Lion's share?
[Tuj] I've always thought it came from a colloquial bastardisation of business - in the sense of "he's the beeesneees" - meaning suited.
Ingnore that post. It's part of an animal. Go back to sleep, Duj.
skin of teeth? No. Some applause from audience, though.
heart's desire? No.
heart of matter, foot of stairs, brains of operation; No, no, no. The + two words, remember.
third word abstract noun? Yes.
lion's share? No.
Is the animal human?
The tooth fairy?
We have a winner! The tooth fairy it is. *places baton under pillow for Rosie to find*
(CdM) It's gone. But I'm richer by 25 pesetas. What joy!

Right, this is MINERAL and ABSTRACT

Does it appear in a particular work of fiction?
Is it man-made?
(Inkspot) - No
(Irouléguy) - No
Does the abstract have something to do with measurement?
(Dujon) Not a thing, I'm afraid. I'm going to bed now - it's 3 a.m. :-(
Cassiopeia?
Is the mineral metal?
(CdM) - No
(ImNotJohn) - No
Is the abstract because it's fictional?
Is it one particular thing?
(Gusset Login) - No, certainly not. Abstract is a valid part-classification but don't concentrate too much on it.
(Irouléguy) No, there are lots of these.
A lodestone?
Is it a human construct?
(Software) - No
(ImNotJohn) No. The abstract nature is not an idea.
The Philosopher's Stone?
(irach) - No.
The Giant's Causeway?
Rock of Ages?
Is it found in a particular place?
Is the mineral solid?
(Kim) - No
(pper) - No
(Tuj) There are lots of them (see above) and there are certainly preferred places.
(Irouléguy) A small amount of it is in some cases, otherwise no.
Ocean currents?
(ImNotJohn) - No
Clouds?
(Irouléguy) - No, but *some applause*
Precipitation?
Can you drink it?
(CdM) - Not the answer, but always involved *more applause*
(Tuj) - You can, and ultimately you do, in some cases.
Rain?
April Showers?
Singing in the Rain?
(irach) - See the answer to CdM's question
(ImNotJohn) - No
(RedSnapper)- No
Tornados?
A meteorological phenomenon?
(Irouléguy) - No - but *some polite applauase*
(Tuj) - Yes *rather more fulsome applause*
The monsoon?
(Raak) - No
Floods?
(irach) - No, but a strong connection.
A spring thaw?
(Dujon) - No, not quite that strong a connection.
Does this involve significant air pressure differences?
A hurricane?
The hydrological cycle?
Is it a one-word answer?
well waddya know - I return after a few days away and here's Rosie - doing a weather one!
(Dujon) - Can do, but that is possibly misleading
(CdM) - No
(Raak) - No
(Chalky) - One word preceded by the indefinite article.
A tsunami?
A thunderstorm?
A cloudburst?
A shower?
(Chalky, ImNotJohn, all) - No, but
*Thunderous applause* for Irouléguy with his bolt from the cumulonmimbus. It it indeed a thunderstorm. Carry on, squire.
Squire tat work this afternoon. A lightning-quick round there - let's hope this one is as quick. I promise to keep the audience sober this time. It is ABSTRACT, involving ANIMAL, VEGETABLE and MINERAL.
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