arrow_circle_left arrow_circle_up arrow_circle_right
AVMA Take 2
help
Yes, it's another round of that classic guessing game - Animal, Vegetable, Mineral, Abstract [or any combination thereof]. This effort - '03/'04 should address any queries, but then again, may just serve to confuse and baffle which some might say is the point of the game. Patience, integrity and a decent search engine may be useful ....
arrow_circle_up
[Boolbar] In a shire? YES
[Raak] Associated with royalty? NO, not closely in the sense I think you mean.
[Software] Windsor Castle? NO
I think a couple of questions could be useful to revisit the answers to (and the audience's reactions). "Latitude" and "Older than 300 years" would be of interest, from memory.
Would longitude be of particular importance?
The Royal Observatory in Greenwich?
[Dujon] Longitude particularly important? NO, other than its importance for any building
[CdM] Greenwich Observatory? NO
I would also remind you that someone lives in it.
Clarence House?
[Clarence House] NO - it's in a "-shire" county
Blenheim Palace?
[Raak] Blenheim Palace - YES. In retrospect, I might have left the leather element out altogether. The latitude at 51.84oN is just less than 52, and the palace was being built 300 years ago.
So, I pass on the baton to Raak with Churchillian gravitas.
The next is ANIMAL.
Audience chuckles as the answer goes up on the laser display board.
Human?
Not human
More chuckling.
Alive?
A single animal?
Mythological?
Not alive.
Not a single animal.
Not mythological.
The audience derives some merriment from all these questions.
Is it manufactured from part or parts of a dead animal?
A dead parrot?
[GL] *applause* Yes, manufactured from dead animals.
[Phil] Not that dead animal.
Glue?
A Tesco economy beefburger?
Leatherwear?
[CdM] Not glue.
[INJ] Not leatherwear.
[Phil] I think that's close enough to the words on the card, "a horsemeat burger". Have this rod of horse, um, jerky.
The laughter was fun :-)
So, next we'll have,

ABSTRACT - with Animal associations

Is the animal connection human?
[Boolbar] Human animal connection? YES
A fictional human?
[GL] Fictional human? NO
The regulations that prohibit horsemeat from human consumption?
[Raak] Anti-equivoreal Regulations? NO
A unique human?
Is it found in the Bible?
Begins with P?
Culture-specific?
[cfm] Unique human? NO
[Boolbar] Found in The Bible? YES *a few chuckles*
[Tuj] Begins with P? YES Applause, cheers, whoops and laughter
[CdM] Culture-specific? YES
Are there other animal associations as well as human?
Philistine?
Question, not insult (well, probably).
[Boolbar] Other animals? NO
[CdM] Me-istine? NO
Pornographic?
:o)
Paternalism?
[Software] Rudey bits? NO!
[cfm] Daddyness? NO
Pilates exercises?
[Raak] Pilates? NO
Paganism?
[cfm] Paganism? NO
Does the answer on the card have more than one word?
[Boolbar] AOC has > 1 word? YES

NB, on reflection for Tuj's "Does it begin with P?" question, I should add that the most important part of the answer on the card starts with "P".

A painted sepulchre?
Is the important P-thing you?
Related to a particular belief system?
Is it related to prayer?
[Raak] Painted sepulchre? NO
[Tuj] Me? NO
[cfm] Related to a particular belief system? NO
[GL] Prayer? NO
A plague of something?
[Raak] Plague? NO
Is there a person's name in the answer?
Related to food?
[Boolbar] A name? NO
[cfm] Foody? NO
A prophesy?
[Raak] Prophesy? NO
Is the specific culture geographically defined/distinct?
[cfm] Geographically defined specific culture? NO - plus I have not strictly said it's one culture.
[Phil] Indeed, I should have asked is/are the specific culture(s) geographically defined/distinct? Thanks for the conscientious clarification, though. :)
Related to language?
[cfm] Related to language? YES *Audience wakes up and applauds*
A parable?
Is it related to many other written works as well as the bible?
[Raak] A parable? NO
[INJ] Related to many other works? YES *enthusiastic applause*
Page number?
[GL] Page number? NO
A catch phrase?
[cfm] A catch phrase? NO
Related to language?
[INJ] Related to language? YES *more enthusiastic applause*
Is the P-word someone's name?
[Raak] A P-name? NO
Does it start with "Ph"?
A Proper Noun?
Has anyone done or used this in this game?
Anything to do with preaching?
[GL] Ph- ? NO
[INJ] A proper noun? NO
[Boolbar] Has it been used in this game? YES, many, many times. *Applause, cheers and a few knowing chuckles*
[Raak] To do with preaching? NO
To do with playing?
A pun?
[Raak] To do with playing? NO
[CdM] A pun? NO.
Some clarification
While I have said no to playing, puns, preaching, proper nouns, philistines, page numbers, catch phrases and others, the answer on the card is related to all these things in a way.
Printed words?
[GL] Printed words? NO (but again, related as above).
The letter P?
[Boolbar] The letter P? YES - plaudits, pleasantries, praise and power be thine. Passing this practically perfect pole of power from person-to-person in the pursuit of pedantic pleasure is a project of prime privilege. Phew!
[Phil] Bravo!
Blimey! Funny enough, I needed a p after all that.
 
Let's do this ...
ABSTRACT (WITH ANIMAL, MINERAL & VEGETABLE ASSOCIATIONS)
An activity
A cracking start.
[NotJohn] Being active? - YES   *Audience look keen*
Creation?
Peeing?
[Gusset Login] Creation? Did you mean The Creation or the act of creation in general? Either way, NO.
However, the AOTC was created, if your meaning was "is it a creation?"
[Phil] Micturate? NO.
A game?
this is going well.
[Raak] Game-on! YES   *applause*
Normally takes place outdoors?
[NotJohn] Normally done outside?   YES
Does the game involve a ball?
Is it widely played in England?
[cfm] Ball Game?   NO.
[Phil] Widely played in England?
Hmmm. I suspect NO. It is played in England (as well as other countries), but not widely (as in often *and* all over the country, e.g. cricket or chess).
Does the game require forming teams?
Ultimate frisbee?
A spectator sport?
[cfm] Teams? NO. I'm sure it can be played with teams, but it isn't usually.
[CdM] Ultimate frisbee? NO.
[Raak] Spectator sport? I think the best answer is NO. But there is nothing to stop people watching!
Are there organised competitions?
Is it normally associated with one culture
e.g. Kabbadi (sp?)
Does the game involve equipment of some kind?
Do the players typically get muddy?
[Phil] Competitions?   YES. I know of at least one.
[ImNotJohn] One culture?   NO. I think.
[cfm] Equipment?   YES-ish. Players need an item to play the game, but calling it equipment is perhaps misleading. Would the pies in a pie-eating contest be called equipment?
[Raak]   Mud glorious mud? NO. But the opportunity is there.
Cheese-rolling?
Does the 'equipment' constitute the vegetable and mineral part of the definition?
[Phil] Chasing Cheese?   NO.  
[NotJohn] 'Equipment' vegetable/mineral?   YES for vegetable traditionally.   Some mineral items can also be used. *Audience applause and murmur*
Is it a game in which two people play against each other?
Is there a non-human animal connection?
Does this involve the throwing/tossing of an object?
Does it involve climbing?
Is the vegetal matter wood?
[Raak] One-against-one? YES.   Or more than two. At least two.
[cfm] Non-human animal? In an abstract way, there is a connection, so YES.   *Audience mutter*
[Dujon] Tossing? YES *A ripple of applause*   Or at least using gravity.
[NotJohn] Climbing? NO.
[Phil] Vegetable wood? YES! *A wave of applause*   The vegetable part could also be a mineral to play, but in the origins of the game, it was vegetable (wood).
Poohsticks?
Golf?
Winner!
[Raak] A hole in one?   NO.
[NotJohn] Poohsticks?   YES!!   Your stick has passed under the bridge first.
Hands NotJohn a somewhat moist twig.
It's the little flick of the wrist as you drop it that makes all the difference.
OK, this one is VEGETABLE or (ANIMAL with ABSTRACT connections)
Wooden Horse?
[Phil] Sylvan equine? - NO
A vegetable?
As in, "a vegetable" being the answer, metaphorical for someone irreversibly brain-dead.
Some great guesses here
[Raak] Vegetable vegetable? - NO
Trojan Horse?
Is this a homograph?
A wooden sculpture?
A swede?
[GL] Trojan Horse? - NO
[Chalky] Homograph? - Tricky, I think it could be argued either way, but I'd go for - NO
[Raak] Wooden Sculpture? - NO
[Dujon] Swede? - NO
Is the Animal a human?
Is it usually eaten?
[Chalky] - Human animal? - YES
[Boolbar] Usually eaten? - NO
Made of paper?
[CdM] Papery? - NO, but * a few suppressed chuckles in the audience*
Is it unique?
Made of wood?
Some progress
[Boolbar] Only 1? - YES for the Animal
[Phil] Woody? - YES for the vegetable
Fictitional Animal?
[Chalky] Fictional Animal? - NO
Is it a tree?
Aha!
[Boolbar] A Tree? - YES *prolonged applause*
Family tree?
[Software] Genealogical? - NO
A specific kind of tree?
Warm
[CdM] Specific kind of tree? - YES *further applause*
Rowan?
Tree of Life?
[Phil] - Rowan? - NO? (So not ROWAN Atkinson, nor ASHley Cole, nor Gabriel OAK, etc)
[cfm] Tree of Life? - NO
Joshua Tree?
[cfm] U2 Tree? - NO (I wondered if someone would guess that)
There is no cheating or discrepancy going on here - the answer, exactly as stated on the card, is both a kind of tree and a unique human animal. Attacking either part is possible. Perhaps inevitably some people will find one alternative easier than the other.
Sequoyah?
[Raak] Sequoia? - NO (I'll look up your spelling - mine is that required to make it the equal shortest word containing all vowels once only)
{Raak] Isn't that fascinating - thank you. It's also a very good guess. Just happens to be incorrect.
Is the tree an evergreen?
Is the unique human male?
[Boolbar] Evergreen - YES
[cfm] - male? - YES
Did he die before 1900?
Died pre-1900? - NO *the audience is hushed*
Courtney Pine?
[Chalky] Courtney Pine? - NO
Stan Laurel?
[Phil} - A laurel called Stan? - NO
Just a a gentle prod, the person is probably the harder element to get for most of you.
Is it a pine tree?
[Boolbar] A pine? - Technically NO, but commonly YES *applause*
Scots pine?
A fir?
[cfm] McPine? - NO
[Raak] Firry? - NO
The monkey puzzle?
I thank my dear late father for one of his useless facts.
Araucaria
We have a winner AND we have a winner
The answer on the card is Araucaria, aka the Monkey Puzzle tree or the Chilean Pine.
Araucaria is also the pseudonym of the Rev. John Galbraith Graham, the doyen of British cryptic crossword compilers, who recently announced that he is suffering from terminal cancer using the answers to clues in one of his puzzles to do so. (Araucaria is suffering from 18 down of the 19, where the clue to 18 down was 'Sign of growth (6)')
Well then, now what do I do - Phil is exactly right, but he set the last one and in the absence of his answer I would have allowed Software's, so I will.
One 'Stick to continue the innings (5)' passed on to Software.
Department of Corrections
That's 'last but one'
Indeed, I meant to add that if I got that right, I would give the baton to Software, as I would not have got it without him. I remember the day (probably early 1990s) that I discovered what the crossword compiler's name meant. I hadn't heard about his illness though. Anyway, onwards and upwards (or downwards and acrosswards)
Department of useless facts
John Graham also sets puzzles under the pseudonym 'Cinephile', which is an anagram of 'Chile Pine'.
Ah, that'll be me then accepting the prickly baton.
Right, ANIMAL with ABSTRACT connections.
Red rum?
Human?
Fictional?
Animal the Muppet drummer?
[GL] Horse meat? NO
[cfm] One of us? YES!
[NJ] Virtual? NO
[Bool] Don't be a Muppet. NO
A unique human?
Currently alive?
[cfm] One-off? YES!
[NJ] Living? YES!
A male?
[Phil] Manly? YES!
The creative type? (writer, visual artist, performer, etc.)
Does this person have some language other than English as his mother tongue?
British?
Is or was involved in politics?
[cfm] arty farty? NO
[CdM] Bilingual? NO
[Raak] True Brit? YES!
[NJ] political animal? NO *some muttering among the audience*
Involved in government?
A member of the Royal Family?
[cfm] Elected? NO *more mutterings in audience*
[Phil] Royalty?NO
A scientist?
Has this person received an honour from the Queen?
A non-elected government employee?
A journalist?
[Phil] Boffin? NO *guffaws from some of the audience*
{Raak} Dubbed? YES! *mutterings among some of the audience*
[cfm] Quangoish? NO *some of the audience have views on this it would seem*
[NJ] Hack? NO
Sebastian Newbold Coe, Baron Coe CH KBE?
David Beckham?
[Raak] Superman? NO
[Phil] Becks? NO
Involved in the Justice system?
[NJ] Judiciary? NO
Involved in the sporting world?
A broadcaster?
[Raak] Sporty?: NO
[Phil] Pundit?: NO (not in the normal sense anyway)
Under 50 years old?
Over 70 years old?
[Phil] <50 years?: NO
[Bool] >70 years?: NO
A businessman?
[Raak] Something in the city?: NO
Does he begin with P?
Involved with education?
An Entrepreneur?
A celebrity chef?
[CdM] P?: NO
[NJ] Tutor?: NO * mutterings among some of the audience *
[Chalks] Wheeler Dealer?: NO
[Raak] Cooking fat?: NO
Summary
A living British man between 50 and 70 with a gong, but not any of: a creative, a non-native English speaker, a politician, a politician in power, employed by the government, a journalist, in the legal profession, a sportsman, a broadcaster, a businessman, a P_____, an educator, an entrepreneur, or a chef.
Was he formerly in any of those professions but is now retired?
[Raak] Retiree?: NO
Has he published written works?
*focusing on the abstract* Do we know about him because of a song or piece of music?
Do we know about him because of something that happened to him?
continuing the thought
Does he work in PR?
[CdM] Author?: NO not in the strictest interpretation, that is
[Chalks] Musical?: NO
[NJ] Events?: YES!
[Phil] Spinner?: NO * chuckles from some of the audience *
Is he known for inventing something?
Was he the victim of a crime?
Did the "something that happened to him" happen outside the United Kingdom?
[Bool] Inventor? NO
[NJ] Mugged? NO
[CdM]Overseas? NO
Did he mount or inspire some kind of protest?
Does he have a Wikipedia entry?
Is he a 'Sir .....'?
[cfm] Protester? NO * some heated discussion among part of the audience +
[Phil] Wikied? YES!
[Chalks] Knighted? NO * spontaneous sporadic claps from audience *
Has this person been stripped of his honour from the Queen?
[Bool] Demoted? NO
Has he received the Order of the British Empire?
Does he have an employer?
[GL] OBE etc? NO
[Phil] Employer? YES! * chuckles from some of the audience *
Is he a 'Lord ...'?
Is he a Duke?
[Chalks] Peer of the Realm? YES!
[GL] Duke? NO
A life peer?
[GL] Lifer? YES!
A man of the cloth?
The Lord Williams of Oystermouth?
(simulposted with Phil)
[Phil] Sky pilot? YES!
[CdM] Lord Who? NO.
Justin Portal Welby?
[NJ] The Lord Archbishop? YES!

Well done! Please accept this Shepherd's Crook shaped baton!

pedantry rears my ugly head
He's not, technically, a life peer, is he? I know ex-Arch B's of C generally are given life peerages, but not until they're ex. I think. I could well be wrong, though :-)
But no applause for my guess? That audience was harsh! Also, not to cavil, but saying "we know about him because of something that happened to him" seems to be dissing someone who rose to the highest possible point on his career path. A bit like saying we know David Cameron or Jack Welch because of something that happened to them (being elected, being appointed by a Board of Directors).
Hmmm.
Yes, I think Sir Alec would have had a few things to say about the ref in that round - I didn't guess earlier because I was sure CdM was right.

Moving on we'll have primarily VEGETABLE with major ANIMAL connections - In fact technically, there are also significant Mineral and Abstract associations as well, but that's not going to help at this stage

Can I eat it?
Can I eat it if Boolbar doesn't?
arrow_circle_down
Want to play? Online Crescenteering lives on at Discord