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Animal-Vegetable-Mineral-Abstract: The Pants Memorial Game
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The chairperson selects an object/idea/whatever and announces whether it's animal, vegetable, mineral, and/or abstract. The others have to ask questions to figure out what it is. Whomever guesses the object correctly is given the chair for the next round; repeat ad nauseam.
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Brunel?
[Inkspot] Yes
[Raak] Yes
What an anti-climax!

Ok, the next is MINERAL, with ANIMAL and VEGETABLE connections.

A stainless steel kitchen knife?
A little bit knee trembling foreplay then straight down business.
Is it made of metal?
Sorry it was an anti-climax, I hadn't expected to be setting one so soon
[Inkspot] No.
[GL] You wouldn't really think of it as something metal, but metal is involved.
If not metal would it be thought of as being made of plastic?
Would I (or anyone else living in the country) find it on a farm?
Did it exist before 1800?
[Inkspot] Not really, although plastic is undoubtedly also present.
[GL] It would be a very unusual farm that had one of these.
[Brendan] No.
Do the animal and vegetable live on the mineral?
Is it man made?
Is it electrically powered?
Is it meant to be moved around?
[Gusset Login] I suspect Raak meant it was an anticlimax to hit upon the answer so rapidly and unexpectedly, rather than that the answer itself was anticlimactic.
Is the animal connection, human?
[BM] I understand what Raak meant and if I had honestly thought I'd win, I would have thought of something harder to guess.
[Kim] Tricky one...let's say that the animal is alive and the vegetable isn't.
[GL] Yes.
[Inkspot] Yes.
[Bm] No.
[GL] Yes.
[Bm, GL] Indeed, no criticism intended.
[Kim] ...and the mineral is pretty much all around them.
Is it a building of some sort?
Is it smaller than a telephone kiosk?
[GL] Yes, hence...
[Inkspot] No.
Is it a Florist?
OK silly question, but worth a shot
M o r n i n g t o n C r e s c e n t ?
[Chalky] what's the vegtable connetion to MC?
[GL] No, but you're thinking on the right lines.
[Chalky] No.
A greengrocer's?
[Bm] No, not quite that close to the right line.
Is the vegetable wood?
Is it a particular retailer? eg Tesco
[Bm] There might well be some, but that's not the main vegetable component.
[Inkspot] No.
Is the vegatable clothes?
s/vegatable/vegetable!
[Dujon] No.
A bakers?
Is it a well-known place [a one-off]?
[Inkspot] No.
[Chalky] Not a one-off. The sort of thing it is is well-known.
Would it be found on the High Street?
Newsagent?
Is the building a shop?
[Chalky] Yes.
[Inkspot] No.
[Brendan] Yes.
Health food shop?
A fast-food joint?
A cafe/restaurant?
An off-license?
[Inkspot] I once went into a health food shop and asked if they had any of a certain thing which the mystery object sells, and it was as if I'd asked for Watney's Red Barrel in a real ale pub.
[Software] No.
[GL] YES! But that's not the whole story.
[Chalky] No.
Is it a retailer of a particular type of hot beverage?
A coffee shop?
A garden centre?
They have cafés...
A vegetarian restaurant?
(Since otherwise there'd be a dead animal component as well as the live one?)
Starbucks?
[Inkspot] Yes.
[GL] YES! But that's still not the whole story. (And "coffee" was indeed the substance that the health food shop looked askance at a request for.)
[ZK] No.
[Brendan] No.
[Kim] It depends on the branch.
A bookshop with a coffee shop inside it?
(the dead vegetables are books?)
A Coffee shop that sells books?
(the dead vegetables are coffee)
[Brendan] No.
[GL] No.
Is it is branch of Starbucks in a particular location?
The vegetables are the ones serving behind the counter.
Is it a take away coffee shop?
The words clutching and straws spring to mind
A coffeshop with a WiFi hotspot?
Is it a cyber cafe?
A Starbucks that is Book-Crossing friendly?
For info, click here. This has been a public service announcement. Thank you.
[Kim] No.
[GL] I'm sure they'll do takeaway if you ask, but most people sit down.
[snorgle] No.
[Software] You are within a gnat's semiote, but...
[all] *DINGDINGDINGDINGDING* A cybercafe is what it is.
OK give me a second...
This one is a MINERAL
Metal?
Rock?
[Raak] Asking for coffee in a health food shop! I'm surprised they didn't throw you out on your ear, or some similarly painful body part.
Is it man made?
Just goes to show, I'd have done the same in seeking out fair trade typish coffee, but seeing as I'm a tea drinker I wouldn't anyway.
the demon drink....well...one of many
They sell barleycup and stuff in health-food shops...shouldn't have been a problem...
Oh yeah, a suggestion
Is it smaller than a phone box?
[Tuj] No
[BM] yes, but it's more than that
[Inkspot] no
[ZK] usually
Is the mineral an element?
Is it solid?
[ZK] it is made from at least one element.
[Inkspot] Yes
Would I find it in my house?
An erratic rocks, left miles from its origin point by a glacier?
[GL] I haven't been to your house. [Brendan] No
Would it be found in the UK?
[Software] Yes
Is it likely to be found in a residential building?
Is it something would be useful to a human being?
[GL] In some, but not as many as you used to
[Chalky] Human beings have been known to find uses for it
Is it decorative?
Coal?
[Chalky] I've often found it to be, but I'm odd
[Bigsmith] Actually, YES. Well done sir/madam/miss!
We'll go with A N I M A L this time.
Human?
Well done!
[Brendan] No (and thanks!)
Mammal?
Is it extinct?
Would it be found in the UK?
Save me thinking
Is it bigger than a loaf of bread?
[all] Yes [Inkers] No [Softers] No (though many others of similar ilk would be) [Gusset Loggers] Yes
Marsupial?
[Kim] Nay
Is it aquatic?
[Inkspot] No (though swimming has been known).
Is it a pig?
Is it kept as a pet?
[GL] No
[Raak] Yes
On an unrelated subject
[Raak] Top work on the Oblig. Limericks page!
Is it a dog?
[Gusset Thing] Yes - BUT - need to be more specific.
Is it a specific dog?
Getting warmer...
[GL] It certainly is.
Right, I'm off down the pub now. Will be sober and on-line by about 10.00am tomorrow, so let's see if anyone can get it by then.
Is it Cliffard The Big Red Dog?
I sincerely hope not
A dingo?
Dogmatix
Is it a breed of dog? Or a particular dog, like Lassie?
I don't believe it
Snorgle hits the back of the net - L A S S I E it is!
goes wild
But seriously, does anyone know what timezone he/she/it is in?
in the Principality
snorgle lives in Gods own country and is probably busy at the moment sledging Caerphilly Hill and building snowmen.
I thought Gods own country was Australia
Animal
I'm in Wales - just busy today! And I'll tell you now, it's not a caracal lynx, friend or otherwise.
Is it human?
Gusset - yes.
Are they alive today?
Is it a he?
I was reliably informed that New Zealand is God's own country, but the report may have been sexed up.
Are they from God's Own Country?
Not sure where that is either. For the sake of someone I've upset recently, let's call it Wales.
Inkspot - Not alive today. BM - Yep. Tuj - no.
Was he born before 1801?
Did he die a violent death?
Royalty?
BM- no. ZK - no. Raak - no.
A Wright brother?
Was he a musician?
Raak - no. Inkspot - yes.
Elgar?
American?
Elvis?
Jim Morrison?
Raak - no. BM - no. Tuj - no. Inkspot - no.
Classical?
Toby - yes. (in the usually accepted sense - I don't know enough about music to break it down any further!)
Zemlinsky?
Raak - nope.
German?
Raak - yep.
Did he die after 1940?
Inkspot - no.
Brahms?
Was he a pianist?
Bach?
Toby - no. Inkspot - Probably, but that isn't what he was famous for. Gusset login - no.
Does his last name begin with 'B'?
Was he born before 1900?
Gusset - no. all - yes.
Is he famous for being a composer?
Inkspot - yes!
Richard Wagner?
Inkspot - no.
Are you sure he's German?
Felix Mendelssohn
Gustav Mahler?
I would just like to say that my son Gustav (1860-1911), was born in Kalischt in what was then Austria, but is now part of the Czech Republic.
Mozart?
Handel?
all - well, I double-checked on several websites and they all agree, so yes.
Inkspot - no.
Gusset - no.
Chalky - no and no.
Johann Gambolputty de von Ausfern- schplenden- schlitter- crasscrenbon- fried- digger- dingle- dangle- dongle- dungle- burstein- von- knacker- thrasher- apple- banger- horowitz- ticolensic- grander- knotty- spelltinkle- grandlich- grumblemeyer- spelterwasser- kurstlich- himbleeisen- bahnwagen- gutenabend- bitte- ein- nürnburger- bratwustle- gerspurten- mitz- weimache- luber- hundsfut- gumberaber- shönedanker- kalbsfleisch- mittler- aucher von Hautkopft of Ulm?
Schumann?
Gluck?
Raak - cut down on the speed.(that means no)
Chalky - no and no.
[Clue]He isn't well-known, at least I hadn't heard of him before last week, when I went to a performance of his most famous work.
Would that have been a symphonic work with no voices?
I.e., not an opera or an oratorio.
Was he born before 1850?
Toby - no. Gusset - no.
Sigmund Romberg?
Carl Ditters von Dittersdorf?
Johann Joseph Fux?
[Everyone] While we are waiting to find out which dead German composer snorgle is, I invite you all to take this short test. Which dead German composer are you?.
Hans Pfitzner?
or maybe.... Max von Schillings?
or perhaps ... Engelbert Humperdinck?
or even --- the OTHER Wagner, Siegfried I think ?
[Chalky] Engelbert Humperdinck was English
[all] No he wasn't ... and I thought snorgle was in the chair? :-)
[Chalky] snorgle is in the chair but that doesn't stop me point out that Englebert Humperdinck wasn't German, and then discovering that there's more than one Englebert Humperdinck. And one of them was German. My humble appology is in the post.
[all] teehee!
In any case, the English one was actually Gerry Dorsey when he used to sing cover versions on Saturday Club hosted by Brian Matthew on the BBC Light Programme in the '60's.
Chalky - yes! Engelbert Humperdinck (the original one) it is! I saw Hansel & Gretel last week, and was surprised by the name - until I looked into it a bit more.
***Goes wild for Chalky***
Splendid!
Now .... let me think ...
Is it Animal, Vegetable, Mineral or Abstract?      Sorry, Chalky!    ;-)
[Dujon] Yes. ;)
... ah yes
Time for an ...
A B S T R A C T
Is it a fictional character/being?
Might as well get this sorted up front this time.
Hello Duj :-) No, sorry. T'ain't one of them there things.
Is it particular to humans?
That's it for tonight. Unless I change my mind.
Is it the unbearable lightness of Being?
Is it a human concept?
Standard opening
[Duj] Yes
[Raak] Curiously enough, that is one of my favourite phrases and have longed to slip it into one of these games. Much as I'd love to say 'yes', in this instance, alas No
[Software] I suppose it must be [see Duj reply]
Is it descriptive of an action?
Is it an emotion?
Is it a religion?
My appologies again
Is it a phrase or expression?
Is it easier than the last one?
[Snodgrass] Sort of, yes
[Gusset] No
[all] No ... hey forget it - I, too, am less than perfect :-)
[Inkspot] In a manner of speaking, yes it is
[Gusset] Indubitably
Getting your leg over?
Hung like a horse?
Is it related to sex?
A leap of faith?
Would it make someone happy? :-)
Is it said/used in everyday conversation?
Does it contain numbers.
?
*rushing back from a meeting...*
[Inkspot] Er ... no
[Bigsmith] Nope
[all] one might think so in view of the previous two questions - and as a matter of fact it *could* be :-)
[Raak] No - but you're moving in the right direction -ish
[Software] NO! good question
[Gusset] Yes
[Kim] It *might* contain numbers but don't let that mislead you
Is it conected with the church?
[all] Not specifically
Can it be percieved by any of the senses?
is it a sinlge word?
single word, even
Curse you dyslexia! You win again!
A curse?
Swearing?
A magic spell?
[Inkspot] It can be perceived by all of the senses
[all] Yes - with the addition of a definite or indefinite article
[Software] Not really
[Gusset] Noo-o-o - but swearing might be applicable afterwards :-)
[Raak] No
Pain?
[Gusset] No
Life?
The universe?
A nightmare?
[Gusset] No
[Raak] nah
... although true pessimists might say that both were this [that was a BIG CLUE].

on spotting a Raak simulpost ... not a nightmare.

It?
Everything?
Would it make someone unhappy?
[Inkspot] No to both
[Raak] The opposite to that question was asked a while back :-) Your answer is YES, it might make someone unhappy, but not necessarily deeply unhappy.
Suffering?
Disappointment?
Pointless?
Being dumped?
[Chalky] Just checking.
[Gusset, Software] One might suffer and be disappointed as a result but the answer is more the 'action' rather than the consequence.
[all] erm .. no
[Raak] No, but being dumped may fall into this category - a more generic word is needed.
Losing?
Is it something most people have probably experienced?
[all] No - but close
[Breadmaster] Absolutely.
Failure?
Rejection?
Missing last orders?
The blues?
Antidisestablishmentarianism?
[all] not quite
[Software] No
[B'smith] No & No
[Gusset] No

CLUE: 'all' did this in the last game :-)

Mistake?
Fuck up?
WELL DONE!! [Software] gets to the post first.
[all] f*cks up :-) sorry
Well I never!!
**Tries to hide behind hands with embarrassment.** Now let me see...thinks :-)

I know! Mineral with Animal connections.

The statue of Greyfriars Bobby in Edinburgh?
A dog lead?
Is it made of metal?
Is it larger than a ballcock?
Is it smaller than a phonebox?
That was quick!
snorgs: No.
all: No
GL: Yes, partly.
BS: Perhaps.
Simpost
all: Yes
Is it decorative?
Does it *look* like an animal?
Would I use it *on* an animal
Is the Animal connection human?
Is the animal connected to it a domesticated one?
A horseshoe?
Is it made for a specific purpose?
Is it a mobile phone?
LG: No.
all: No.
Kim: Yes.
Tuj: No, see Kim.
Brendan: No.
Inks: Yes.
all: No.
Is the non-metal component plastic?
(psst, Software, you missed Breadmaster's "Does it look like an animal?")
Does one wear it?
Is it electrical?
Does it connect physically to a human?
Humans are domesticated (usually)
Is there only one of it?
Bren: Yes.
Raak: No.
LG: Sometimes.
all: No -my ex-wife wasn't!
BM: No.
Do most people have one?
I did say usually
Would most people want one?
Is it used for entertainment?
all: Hard to say, I have one.
BM see above.
GL: No
GL: Don't go there ;-)
Do you keep yours at home?
Go where?
GL: Yes
Do you use it every day?
Is it some form of communications device?
Sorry to interrupt AVMA for a moment, but since [Software]'s definitely reading this: gigni de nihilo ... over on MCiOS is a reverse game. The idea is that if you read the game backwards, it'll all make sense. This means that new moves have to be consistent with what's already been said "in the future". So, for example, fairly early in the game you'll find Blob saying "[Néa] To answer you question - not recently I'm afraid, the last time was on the East London Line between Shadwell & Wapping." and then later on Néa asking "Incidentally, did anybody here ever pull the emergency brake while drunk?", setting up Blob's answer. As far as I can tell, you've been playing it forwards all along -- hence all the comments about you developing precognition and so on, which are an attempt to make your comments make sense in the context of the reverse flow.
BM: Clue, perhaps - Most days.
Brendan: :-*
Is it a personal organiser?
A toothbrush?
Following Brendan's Comments above
Software re: The Reverse Crescent Game in MCiOS. Yup - because you seemed to 'pick' on me nearly every time you posted something, you completely f*cked up my gameplan. I left loads of messages for you - so did Darren - and others dropped hints. Eventually I gave up and dropped out of the game :-(
Is it a spinning around clothes drying thing?
...back to the game
Is it a toilet brush?
ZK: No
Toby: No.

Chalks: My humblest appologies :-o , I was completely off the scent on that one :-/ , sorry to spoil your fun, I'll stick to the things I know best in future.

Chalks: No & No.

A cuddly toy?
[S'ware] apology accepted :-)
Is it related to sex?
Ok, everything could be related to sex, but some things are more closely related than others.
Is it a pharisee?
Chalks: No, this is not the generation game :O).
Raak: Unlikely - but, hey, whatever turns you on ;-)
Chalks: No, it is Mineral with Animal connections, remember.
A penguin [bar]?
doggy widdle?
sorry - just remembered it's mineral with animal connections
Is it something one enjoys using?
Chalks ;-))
Raak: Not particularly, unless one had such a fettish.
Is it a hoover?
Bren: No.
A toothbrush?
A K-Tel nose hair trimmer?
A razor?
Also based on the assumption that disposables are made of metal and plastic to shave the human animal and they often come in the "electrical" variety - and blokes tend to use them daily or almost as often, with girls slightly less often needing a boyfriend at this time of night declared
Could you lift it with one hand?
[ZK] Awww... maybe you should use that K-Tel nose hair trimmer a little more frequently... ;-)
Have you died?
[Breadmaster] They don't make industrial strength ones, you see :)
Back from a relaxing weekend without a PC in my face.
Raak: No.
ZK: No & No.
BM: Yes (in most cases).
ZK: No.
Is it computerised?
Why is this such a boring one?
Can we have a clue?
Chalks: Because nobody has asked the right questions.
all: Yes, I'm getting bored too. You probably have several of these about the office/college/school.
Is it a telephone?
A stapler?
First thing on my desk that I saw ...
I know what's bugging me about this one - the 'animal' connection .... what does 'connection' actually mean? Is there a bit of animal in it? or is used by an animal [in this case human]? If it's the latter, isn't it rather superfluous and misleading to add the animal bit?
GL: No.
Bren: No, but you are now on the right tack.
Chalks: In this case the human connection is that this object would be unable to perform any function without human assistance.
Hole punch?
Ring binder?
Is it human-powered?
all - has it! Cheers and whoops from audience!

Over to you all!

At f*r*i*g last!
This one is an ANIMAL, and hopefully will be easier to guess
Human animal?
Come on now, it wasn't that difficult!
[Software] Yes - It took a long time to work out, that makes it difficult
Alive?
IMO
[S'ware] The 'Animal' part was superfluous and misleading. Many examples of this type of equipment have been posted as the 'object' in the past - simply as Mineral. You replied to my earlier question [and I quote] "Because nobody has asked the right questions." I completely disagree.
[Kim] No
Brutus? (of "et tu" fame)
'cos it's always fun to start with a completely random guess.
A certain individual animal?
Chinese?
Well, it's a one in five chance!?
Did they die before 1900?
Male?
[Brenda] No - but it was worth a shot
[Raak] Yes - an individual dead human (see above)
[Tuj] No
[Ink] Yes
[Snodster] No - I'm fairly certain she wasn't
Were they born before 1500?
[Inkspot] No
Religious figure?
Was he a scientist?
[Brendan] No
[Inkspot] No, and as said before not a 'he'
Joan of Arc?
[Software] No, Joan of Arc was born before 1500
Mary Shelley?
Just testing ;)
[Inkspot] No
Was she born before 1800?
[Inkspot] Yes
Is she an author?
Elizabeth I?
Was she a religious figure?
[Inkspot] She isn't. She wasn't famous for being an author.
[Raak] No, but you're think on the right lines.
[Kim] See the answer I gave when Brendan asked that.
[Raak] I meant thinking not think obviously
Mary, Queen of Scots?
[snorgle] No
Was she European, other than British?
[Inkspot] No
Was she a royal of some description?
just trying to clarify what "along the right lines" means (couldn't be Queen V herself, of course, since she died in 1901 ...)
Was she associated with royalty, without being royalty herself?
Lady Jane Grey
[Brendan] Yes (It also couldn't be Queen V because she wasn't born before 1800)
[Raak] At one time
[Inkspot] No.
If not an author, a diarist Elizabeth Pepys?
Nell Gwynne?
[Inkspot] No.
[Kim] No.
One of Henry VIII's wives?
Queen Anne?
[all] For some reason I read the wrong answer, and thought you'd said "No" to born pre-1800 ... Doh!
Mary wife of William III (of Orange)?
[Raak] Yes
[Braendan] You are so very close - We can all make mistakes
[Inkspot] No
Anne Boleyn?
[Brendan] Yup.

Audience - Cheers and Adulation for Brendan
OK, let's have a MINERAL/VEGETABLE (with ABSTRACT overtones). If it becomes obvious that this classification is confusing people, I'll give some pointers ...
Is it made of wood?
And metal?
A painting?
Is the vegetable, paper?
[all] in part, but probably not a large part (NB: I am considering "made of wood" to mean dead wood in some way arranged by humans; ie in my definition a tree is not "made of wood" -- which I admit is eccentric)
[Software] probably in places, but it's not a major component
[Raak] No, but keep plugging at why it has abstract overtones
[Inkspot] No.
Half a dead cow in formaldehyde?
Is the vegtable part a tree?
Oops, ignore my last, dead cow isn't mineral or vegetable.
Half a dead tree in formaldehyde?
Is it unique?
[Raak] No, in either case. [all] Not "a" tree. [Inkspot] Yes.
Hyde Park?
Does the vegetable part involve more than one tree?
Is it a geographical landmark?
Is it a work of art?
[all] No.
[GL] Yes!
[Inkspot] No.
[Raak] The "it" you are looking for isn't, but a work of art (in the broadest sense) is involved.
Is it a forest?
Is it a real place mentioned in literature like Sherwood Forest?
[Tuj] Yes, but not just that.
[Inkspot] You're getting very close, but the answer to that particular question is No.
Is it the Hundred Acer Wood?
Is it Mirkwood?
Fangorn Forest?
The Forest Moon of Endor?
stop looking at me like that!
[Gusset] No.
[snorgle]No.
[Breadmaster] Nope.
[all] Nope!
All good guesses, but remember it isn't just a forest.
Is it from LOTR?
Under Milk Wood?
Not Forest Gump either then
Can it move around?
Burnham Wood?
[Gusset] No.
['spot] No.
[Breadmaster] No.
[all] No.
When I say it's not just a forest, I mean there's other stuff too, not that it's a special sort or specific example of a forest. The trees are definitely a major component of the mystery item, but perhaps not the one people immediately think of.
The Eden Project?
The Angel of the North?
Is it fictional?
[Bm] No.
[Raak] No.
Because ... [Tuj] Yes!
Babylon 5?
Is it from a film like the 'Valley Forge' in Silent Running?
The forest referred to in the phrase "Can't see the forest for the trees"?
Is the fictional setting concerned a movie?
[Raak] No.
[Inkspot] No.
[snorgle] No, it is from a specific work.
[ZK] No, not a movie.
Is it a city?
The Forbidden Forest from Harry Potter which is based on the Forest of Dean?
[all] No, but it is within/near one.
[Inkspot] No.
The Hanging Gardens Of Babylon?
Central Park?
Is it from a book?
[snorgle] I've made mistakes with these things before, but are you sure Central Park contains a forest? and is fictional?
Is it an old oak tree with a yellow ribbon tied around it?
[GL] I don't think the Hanging Gardens were fictional either, although not much is known about them.
[BM] There's no proof that it ever existed apart from a book written by someone who never went within a hundred miles of the area it was rumoured to be. But I take your point
Was the book written after 1900?
Nottingham Forest?
I know Sherwood was mentioned earlier but Notts Forest are a fictional entity, ie they are alledged to be footballers - but nice people all the same who always invite me to their end of season party in January each year.
[Gusset] No.
[snorgle] Alas, too real.
[all]Erm. The work in question is commonly found in books but it is not a book per se. Does that make sense?
[Breadmaster] No.
[Inkspot] No (bearing in mind the above caveats about the phrase "the book").
[Snodgrass] LOL. No.
PS [Snodgrass] Are you also alleging that all the players are vegetables? ;)
Was the book written before 1980?
bearing in mind the above caveats about the phrase "the book"
I meant 1880!
Is it from a poem?
Is it from a play?
Utopia?
[GL] Yes, before 1880.
[Inkspot] Indeed it is. Therefore ...
[Raak] No.
[all] No.
Herot?
Xanadu?
I mean, of course, the location of Kubla Khan's pleasure dome, and not the improbably awful film starring Olivia Newton John and Gene Kelly. On roller skates. In pink. With the Electric Light Orchestra.
[Gusset] No.
[Breadmaster] DING! DING! DING! Yes! It was indeed those twice five miles of fertile ground, with walls and towers girdled round, forests ancient as the hills, gardens bright with sinuous rills, etc. etc. Congratulations. The floor is yours.
Huzzah!
Give me a few moments to thing of something sufficiently fiendish.
ABSTRACT
OK, let's see how this plays out.
Is it an emotion?
[ZK] Nope.
Is it a human concept?
[ZK] No - although some may be involved.
Can it be detected with any of the senses?
[Brendan] An interesting question. I would say technically no, but your senses might well alert you to its presence.
Is it a natural event or happening?
Is it a naturally occurring phenomenon?
Dooo-dooo do-doodoo...
The monster under the bed?
[Inkspot] No.
[Tuj] No.
[Raak] No, that's very much ANIMAL.
I should warn you all that I'm not at work today and tomorrow and my internet access is currently a little erratic, so many apologies if there are gaps between my answers... I shall do my best though!
Is it existence?
straight in with a random guess
Is it a phrase or expression?
Does it have to do with the passage of time?
Is it connected with the supernatural
(Brendan: All footballers get covered in mud, Vegetables grow in the soil (ok not all so sue me!), therefore all footballers............. eat vegetables and you are what you eat. And Forest are neither Super nor Natural before you ask - C'mon you R's)
Is it electricity?
[Snodgrass] Your mastery of syllogism is unmatched!
[all] No.
[Inkspot] No.
[Kim] No.
[Snodgrass] Aha! Yes.
[Brendan] No.
A ghost?
Banquo's Ghost?
An Orb?
To those of you without Living TV you have been spared the antics of Derek Acorah and Yvette Fielding chasing ghosts and flying balls of light around the country and having theatrical panic attacks as they go. What a rich cultural medium digital TV can be!
A poltergeist?
[Raak] No.
[GL] No.
[Snodgrass] No, and I thank you for that terrifying vignette. Yvette Fielding?!
[all] No.
Possession of some sort [by the devil or his disciples]?
[Chalky] No.
Is it related to some sort of concept of the afterlife?
A magic spell?
ah...Raak may have pre-empted my next line of questioning ... is it Black Magic?
I don't have a suggestion
[Snodgrass] I happen to like that programme!
backtracking in realisation
Not that believe it all, you understand!
Voodoo ?
[ZK] Sorry, no offence intended. I quite enjoy it too, in small measure, but the histrionics do rather detract from what might, otherwise, be a serious attempt to uncover something we understand little about. Did you watch the celebrity version last weekend?
[Brendan] Yes.
[Raak] Nope.
[Chalky] Not that either.
[Snodgrass] Nope. How do you have a celebrity ghost-chasing programme? Were they hunting Elvis, James Dean, Buddy Holly etc?
Is it re-incarnation ?
[Breadmaster] The celebs were doing the hunting - or more accurately staying 2 nights in a spooky castle and having the willies put up them so to speak (but thats one for a different channel I expect). You know, I'm a Celebrity - Get 8 shades of wos'name out of me!
I despair of modernity...
[Snodgrass] Nope.
[Snodgrass] Sadly not, as I only have Sky when I'm living at home.
Transubstantiation?
is it Hell?
Valhala?
The Holy Spirit?
Is the afterlife in question the Christian one?
Nirvana?
Purgatory?
Would a river be pertinent?
[Raak] No.
[all] No.
[GL] No.
[Brendan] No.
[Kim] No.
[Raak] No.
[Dujon] It wouldn't.
Don't get too hung up on the afterlife thing - it's only related to it.
Is it a Philosophy?
[GL] It might be, depending on how you define "philosophy".
Is it a fear?
[Inkspot] No.
Is it a religion?
[all] A breakthrough! Yes.
Catholicism?
blimey - I thought we'd eliminated the 'religion' thing ages ago - perhaps I just imagined it!
[Chalky] No. No, I was surprised no-one tried that earlier, but they didn't...
Buddism?
Islam?
I meant buddhism, obviously
A religion is a philosophy, unless your a fanatic.
[GL] No. There's more to religion than philosophy, though - it is a sociological phenomenon which may include a philosophy, but also other things such as liturgy. I think.
[all] Nope.
theophobia?
[Inkspot] No, but I'd love to know more about the Theophobic Church...
Does it profess to be some variety of the Christian religion?
[Raak] It does not.
Scientology?
[BM]The basis of all religion is a philosophy, which is also the most important part of the religion. It's easy to quote (for example) the Bible but very few of those that do make any effort to love their fellow man.
[GL] Of course, it depends on what you mean by "philosophy". But if you mean ethics, I still say that's only one element of religion, and not necessarily the most important part: for example, Jesus taught ethics, but he seems to have been more interested in eschatology. One should always be very wary of saying things like "the essence of all religions is X" because religions are rather complex things that vary greatly.
Oh yes. No.
Is it monotheistic?
[Raak] Largely, but it's a matter of some debate.
Is it Hindu?
[BM] Philosophy generally means an outlook or set of beliefs that underpin your thinking. An ethical philosophy is only one example of this cynical philosophies have more appeal but are less used by religions. But all religions are in essence telling people how they should think (not what they should think, just how).
Eschatology is part of the philosophy of most religions
[GL] It is not.
I take your point, although I think you're defining "philosophy" a little loosely.
Was it founded in the last 200 years?
[Brendan] Nope.
Sikhism?
Philosophy
noun: any personal belief about how to live or how to deal with a situation (Example: "Self-indulgence was his only philosophy")
noun: the rational investigation of questions about existence and knowledge and ethics
noun: a belief (or system of beliefs) accepted as authoritative by some group or school
[GL] Still so.
By which I meant, of course, still no.
Is it a brand of islam?
Judaism?
[all] No.
[GL] No.
Is it extant?
It it a associated with the far east?
Is it Zen?
[Raak] It is.
[Inkspot] Not the far east, no.
[GL] It is not.
Just confirm it's from the middle east? but not connected with Islam?
[GL] Two questions shock! Yes, it is from the Middle East, and there may be connections with Islam, but if so I think they're likely to be pretty indirect.
It can only be a matter of time now.
Was it founded by a swordsman called Zoro his adventures later being made into numerous films?
[Inksopt] No, but it should have been, hence...
Is it Sufism? -Apologies for joining in so abruptly
[Phahad] Feel free to join in, but no - it's not Islam, remember.
Is it popular outside the middle east?
[Gusset] If this religion is defined a little broadly, I believe that today it does have more adherents outside the Middle East than it has within it.
Taoism?
[all] No.
You know, I really think Inkspot will get it...
Zoroastrianism?
(I may have spelt that wrong)
Zoroism?
simulpost....and Brendam beat me to it *laughs*
I meant BrendaN of course *laughs again*
[Brendan] YES! And I believe you spelt it entirely correctly.
Having recently had a go, I'm entirely happy to cede in favour of either Inkspot, who clearly had it and was just messing around, or Chalks, who I simulposted. That said, I do have a particularly silly idea for a round ... I'll leave it a few hours and if neither of those two starts one I will.
Pah! I'd have won it if it hadn't been for those pesky kids!
applause and cheers
A good win and well set by the Breadmaster.
Silly idea
OK, then, my silly idea: bifurcated AMVA. I've got two separate "objects" in mind which can be referred to by the same word(s). Hence, for each question I'll give two answers, one for the first object and one for the second, eg "Is it made of wood?" "Yes/No" Hope that makes sense.
So, the objects are ANIMAL/ANIMAL.
Is it a quagga?
Leaf?   OK, just a mad guess.   :-(
However, is that the idea, Brendan?
Is either human?
An interesting conceit!
A mammal?
Bigger than a Coconut?
[Raak] No/no.
[Dujon] No/no.
[Bm] Yes/Yes.
[Inkspot] Yes/Yes (see above).
[Snodgrass] Yes/Yes. (Unless it's a giant mutant coconut you have in mind)
Are they particular humans (as opposed to a type, job, class etc)?
Interesting - looks like we have two people with the same name, or perhaps similar titles?
Is the name for either an occupation?
[Breadmaster] Yes/Yes
[snorgle]No/No
Are they male?
Are they still alive?
Englebert Humperdinck?
Are they British?
[Breadmaster] Yes/Yes.
[Raak] Yes/No.
[Bigsmith] No. (Good guess though!)
[Inkspot] Yes/No.
Male?
[Brendan] Thanks, I thought it an apt guess after his/their appearance in an earlier game!
Jerry Hall?
One's an American model, the other an Irish guy I used to work with.
Obviously not as neither are British, and both are still alive - sorry, somehow transposed the answers in my tiny mind...
Are they nobility?
[Bigsmith] Er, yes and the male I already answered to Breadmaster's last Q.
[Breadmaster] Ooh, excellent question! No/Yes
Winston Churchill?
Is the Dead one the Noble one?
[Brendan] I can assure you that my coconuts are not mutant or deformed in any way!
(Bod No2) Is he an American?
Are they actors?
Assuming that Brendan always refers to them in the same order, it looks like one is alive, British, and not noble, while the other is dead, not British, and noble. I think.
[Raak] No.
[Snodgrass] Yes. (FWIW, I'm maintaining consistency -- ie there is a distinct Left-Hand-Side object and a distinct Right-Hand-Side object.)
[Inkspot] No/No.
[Breadmaster] No/No. Your summary is spot on.
Is he a singer?
Are they remembered as a duo, ie. were they 'connected' before one of them died?
Are we talking 'leaders of nations' here?
[Brendan] Quite how someone can be Noble without being British is quite difficult to comprehend - Xenophobia Rules OK!
Supp to above:. Leader in a Sporting field?
Political?
Writer?
Royalty?
[GL] Yes, but not just that/No (see below though)
[Chalky] No.
[Snodgrass] Not remotely/Not quite
[Snodgrass] No/No
[Snodgrass] No/No
[Breadmaser] It would be misleading to say Yes, but Yes, in a manner of speaking/No
[Raak] No/Yes
Observation/Hint: There seems to be an implicit assumption in some of these questions that the sum total of people involved is two. This is not the case.
Are either of the subjects a single person (ie a solo subject not just unmarried)
Did they die before 1900?
Obviously this only applies to the dead one
[Snodgrass] No/Yes
[Gusset] No/No
Were either of the named Rasputin?
Did they die before 1950?
[Gusset] No/No
[Breadmaster] No/Yes
Is the currently alive one a pop group?
[Raak] Yup.
Has the pop group been around for more than twenty years?
...otherwise I'll never have heard of it.
Do they have a song in the current UK Top 40?
Austrian Archduke?
[Raak] No.
[GL] Not at this precise moment in time, but they have relatively recently.
[Inkspot] No/Yes! (You've got it, haven't you?)
Franz Ferdinand?
[Gusset] Correct. It was indeed Franz Ferdinand (current flavour of the millisecond with the NME) on the LHS, who are named after Franz Ferdinand (Austrian Archduke and famous casue of WWI) on the RHS. Congratulations, and over to you!
I didn't know it was a pop group
Anyway, hmm... ANIMAL (with ABSTRACT connections)
Fictional?
[BM] Yes.
Of human form?
[Chalky] I assume you mean is it human? No
Is it a person?
[BM] That depends how you define person. I know someone who considers there pet cat to be a person.
I mean "their pet cat"
Is it an animal that talks?
Pesky line-managers!
[Inkspot] It talks after a fashion, but the term animal may be misleading.
Does it communicate telepathically?
[Brendan] No.
Is it known from appearing in a particular story?
[Inkspot] Yes, but it also appeared in the sequel(s)
Aslan?
[Bren] No
Is it a kind of animal that really exists?
[BM] No.
Is the author still alive?
Is it a dragon?
[Inky] Author may be the wrong word, but... Yes
[Bren] No
Is the work of fiction a film?
[Brendan] Yes.
Is it a character from Star Wars?
[Inkspot] Yes.
is it a cartoon character?
drat - simulpost. I've just wasted a question
Is it Jar Jar Binks?
In which case, may God have mercy on your soul for reminding us of that execrescence!
Chewbacca?
that ChewBacca thingy?
another bleedin' simulpost...sorry Inks!
[Chalky] no
[BM] Thankfully not
[Inkspot] Yes
[Chalky] Rwwwar!
Well Done Inkspot
Thank you Gusset Login for a great AMV for a Friday Afternoon.

eyes down looking ... MINERAL

Is it man-made?
I have released any of my AMVs to the public, or do you mean AVMA? 8)
A household implement?
Some day I'll get Broadband, then I can devote more attention to quicker-fire games like this... But it's so nice just to read the pages that happen in between and how an idea is pursued and grasped betwixt-times!
Gusset Login] No ....must remember, less haste more speed ;)
Tuj]No
Is it a geographical feature?
Raak]Yes
Is it in the UK?
[Raak] nice one!
Chalky] Yes
England?
Somerset?
Not thinking of anything in particular
Scotland?
Chalky]No
Tuj]No
Breadmaster]No
...and hence it is in...
The Channel Islands?
Raak]No ;)
The Giants Causeway?
Just a stab in the dark. Well its sunny now but you know what I mean!
Snodgrass]No ...sunny? not here its high winds and showers.
Snowdon?
Raak] YES .... Mount Snowdon it is ... and in just ten guesses!

Huge round of applause

The next object is MINERAL, with ABSTRACT connections.
"There is no spoon?"
I think that last one would've been less than 10 if it wasn't for me, but hey, let's make a mess while we can!
[Tuj] No, there is no spoon.
Does it contain metal?
[Bm] No.
Is it larger than a coconut?
No I don't know why that is my yardstick either!
Is it fictional?
[Snodgrass] Yes.
[Bm] The abstract connection is its appearance in fiction, but it also exists in reality.
Man-made?
[Brendan] No.
Does it contain rock or stone?
[Bm] No.
Metal?
[Snodgrass] No.
Is it a solid state object?
[Inkspot] No.
Is it on the Earth?
Is it a liquid?
[Brendan] Yes, and no doubt on some other planets as well, but there's no-one around to see it.
[Inkspot] Partly.
Does it contain water?
[Bm] Yes.
Does it contain ice?
Does it contain more than trace amounts of anything other than water?
[Gusset L] It could, but the typical one doesn't.
[Brendan] Yes.
Does it have a use?
Is mud involved?
Is it an atmospheric phenomenon?
[Chalky] No.
[Gusset Login] No, although it might be a side-effect.
[Bm] YES! A breakthrough!
Is it rain?
cloud?
[Kim] Rain is a major part of it.
[snorgle] Cloud, too.
A hurricane?
Is the fictional connection one specific work?
[snorgle] No.
[Brendan] It includes one specific work.
A tornado?
Twister?
A thunderbolt?
Is the significant part of it that isn't water, made of dead vegitation?
Since both clouds and rain are made of water
Is it the tornado that took Dorothy Gale to Oz?
[GL] No.
[Chalky] No.
[Software] No.
[all] No.
[Bm] No.
Can you confirm this summary?
It's an atmospheric phenomenon
Contains more than a trace of something that isn't water
Contains nothing man-made
Does not contain any metal, rock, stone or wood
Is used in fiction
Is found on earth, but may exist elsewhere
[GL] Spot on.
The Northern Lights?
A Rainbow?
[Chalky] No.
[GL] No.
Is it the title of a play?
[Inkspot] Not that I know of.
Is it likely to be dangerous?
An interesting conundrum from Raak here... Good stuff!
[Bm] Can easily be.
Does it occur all over the world?
[Inkspot] I believe it can happen in most places. More in some than in others.
Is the specific fictional work a film?
Is it a thunderstorm?
Is it a snowstorm?
A whirlpool? El Niño?
well, the sea contains more than trace elements of something other than water...
[Brendan] No.
[Chalky] applause from audience That could be part of it.
[Darren] silence from audience That could be part of it as well, but it's probably not what you would first think of.
[ZK] No.
Is it a monsoon?
Is it a name for an extreme weather condition?
[Brendan] No.
[Inkspot] Not a name, and not all that extreme.

A hint about the fictional connection: there are actually two fictional connections: one a specific work which mentions it, and the other a body of fictional work in which it recurs from time to time.

The Jet Stream?
Acid rain?
[S] No.
[GL] No.
Thinking some more about the "more than trace amounts of something that isn't water," is this something Fortean like a shower of fish?
Is it about seeing clearly now that the rain has gone?
Weather [aka Climate]??
Singing in the Rain?
[Darren] No.
[GL] Quite the reverse.
[S] No.
[all] No.
The Calm before the storm?
Does it contain anything else apart from water and air?
(assuming that air is at least part of the non-water content)
The eye of the storm?
[GL] No.
[Brendan] No. Air is indeed the non-water part.
[Bm] No.

Ok, so it's established that storm is a significant part of it.

The Perfect Storm
[Snodgrass] No.
St Elmo's Fire?
Not really to do with air and water so much as electricity, but frankly, my flum is utterly moxed at this point.
[Brendan] No.
Trust me, you'll all know exactly what it is, and recognise its fictional appearances, when the answer is revealed.
The / A Tempest?
I don't know about flummoxed I haven't got a Clooney hence the frantic straw clutching with a perfect storm.
The specific fictional work was it written before 1940?
see if this will clear the fog a little.
Is a property of the general class of fictional works that they're set at sea?
[Snodgrass] No.
[Inkspot] Yes.
[Brendan] No.
April Showers?
Bermuda Triangle?
The fictional work referred to previously - is this a song?
[GL] No.
[Chalky] No.
[Darren] No.

Time for a hint?

Does the answer appear in the title of the work?
Raak]How about a one or two more questions on the source of the work, followed by a hint.
Is the fictional work pre-1850?
Is the fictional work by a man?
Fog?
[Inkspot] No.
[Brendan] Yes.
[Darren] Yes.
[snorgle] No.
The answers to Brendan and Daniel refer to the specific fictional work, not the body of fictional work, for which the answers would be No and Yes.
Daniel?!
Is the fictional work/body of work pre-1500?
I must admit I'm running out of questions here. Fiendish problem-setting from Raak and a good puzzle.
Is the fictional work European in origin?
[Darren[ Oops, sorry.
[Bm] No/No.
[Darren] Yes (but the fictional body of work isn't).

Hint: The fictional work is a novel, and the fictional body of work is a cartoon strip.

(novel)Was it written after 1900?(cartoon) did it appear in a comic?
Is it a dark and stormy night?
(in which case, I'm assuming the cartoon strip is Peanuts ...)
[Inkspot] No/No.
[Brendan] YES, it is a dark and stormy night!
Excellent puzzle, Raak!
OK, let's have an ANIMAL.
Is it a shaggy dog?
Continuing the dark and stormy night theme and the 'wouldnt send a dog out on a night like this' idea
[Snodgrass] Sadly not.
Is it human?
Is it a specific individual?
[GL] No.
[Raak] No.
Is it a fish out of water?
Is is mammalian?
[GL] No.
[Kim] No.
Is it a reptile?
Is it extinct?
Is it a bird?
Is it indiginous to a particular continent?
Raak] A wonderful candidate for Limited Short Stories sometime. The opening chapter of Paul Clifford by Edward Bulwer-Lytton.
Is it an insect?
[GL] No.
[all] Yes!
[Raak] No.
[Inkspot] No.
[Kim] No.
Is it a fish?
In the water this time
Is it a Tasmanian Wolf?
Did it live between 225 and 65 million years ago?
Is it a single celled organism?
[GL] No.
[all] Nope.
[Inkspot] Nuh uh.
[R.J.F.] It is not.
Is it a virus? (since they don't really have cells)
Did it become extinct during recorded history?
A Sabre Toothed Tiger
Is/was it fictional?
Did it live between the present and 65 million years ago?
[Darren] No.
[Raak] No.
[Snodgrass] No.
[GL] No, entirely real. I'm not even aware of any famous appearances in fiction.
[Inkspot] Good question: no.
Did it live underwater?
Summarising...
Animal, but not a bird, fish, reptile, insect, mammal, single-celled organism, or virus. Not indigenous to any particular continent. Went extinct more than 225 million years ago.
Was it a vertebrate?
[GL] Yes.
[Raak] An accurate summary, and no.
Was it amphibian?
A trilobite?
[Inkspot] No.
[Raak] Correct!
Gosh, er, let's see....

ABSTRACT, with VEGETABLE connections

Is it fictional?
Standard opening.
[Bm] No.
Is it something which can be an attribute of a human?
Is it a song title?
[Darren] No.
[Dujon] No.
Is it connected with environmental issues?
[Raak, Brendan] well played on both the 'setting' and 'guessing' - wish I had the opportunity to participate more this week :-(
Is it a human concept?
Standard opening number two.
Is the vegetable connection something to do with food?
Is it a well known phrase or saying?
Is the vegetable a fruit?
I shoudl revise the description to say it can be either ABSTRACT with VEGETABLE connections or VEGETABLE with ABSTRACT connections. And the VEGETABLE might include ANIMAL as well, depending.

[Chalky] No.
[Bm] Yes (this applies to the possible ANIMAL part as well).
[Darren] Yes.
[GL] No.
[Inkspot] No.

Is it a turnip for the books?
Is the vegetable connection, a vegetable?
Is it an amusingly-shaped vegetable/fruit?
[RJF] No.
[Inkspot] No.
[Chalky] No.
Is it a name of something a man made to be eaten?
eg a birthday cake.
Is the vegetable a forest?
[Inkspot] Yes.
[GL] No.
An easter egg?
[Inkspot] No.
A simnel cake?
Very seasonal.
[Software] No. And the mystery object isn't seasonal.
Is it associated with a particular country?
Does it involve chocolate?
Is it a chocolate orange?
Is it a type of pie?
[Inkspot] Not very strongly.
[all] No.
[GL] No.
[Darren] No.
Is it associated with a particular part of the day?
[Inkspot] No.
Is it a drink?
Is it boiled?
Blame the last question on the cup of tea, it wanted a mention.
[Inkspot] No, hence also, no.
The Gingerbread Man?
[GL] No.
Does it involve eggs?
[GL] All the recipes I found through Google do (which was a surprise to me, but I know little of how they are made).
Is it nomally eaten hot?
Rakk]A hen lays them! :p
Is normally frozen?
[Inkspot] So do ducks and most lizards
[Inkspot] No.
[GL] No.
Does it involve flour?
Is it a confectionary?
GL]and there was me being deliberatley obtuse over a form of words that tickled my funny bone ... simple pleasures for a Friday morning (hens don't lay recipes.)
Is it a cake?
[Inky] Duck and lizards do lay recipes. If you feed them right
[Brendan] Yes.
[Inkspot] Not really, although one might classify it as such.
[GL] It's closer to cake than confectionery.
Bread of some sort?
Is it a combination of different foods?
[GL] It is about as closely related to bread as it is to cake.
[Kim] No.
Does it contain cream?
[Inkspot] It can. At least, the concrete version can, the abstract one can't.
Does it involve pastry?
Is it a pancake?
Ambrosia?
Pardon my second guess here, but is it Pancake Day?
[GL] No.
[Darren] No.
[Chalky] No.
[Darren] No.

I'm going to be away all of tomorrow and some of Sunday, so let's see this one solved today.

Is it a type of cookie/biscuit?
[GL] No. Of the things mentioned, it's most like cake, a little less like bread or pancakes, somewhat less like a cookie/biscuit or pastry, and least like confectionery. It has this in common with pancakes, though, that you can combine it with pretty much anything else. And don't forget the abstract part, which is nothing to do with any festival or work of fiction.
Does the 'Abstract' element have a mythological/religious connection?
This is tricky because it seems we're guessing on two fronts.
Ah - simulpost. It seems you read my mind, Raak.
Is this something like tofu?
[Chalky] The abstract element is part of, or an aspect of, the concrete thing.
[Darren] No. This is something that is not only edible, but one would want to eat.
Well - I was thinking along the lines of Manna from Heaven or something like?
[Chalky] No, you can buy these everywhere, or make them yourself. Nothing supernatural involved.
Gingerbread men?
That doesn't satisfy the "you can combine it with anything" though.
[Darren] No.
Marmite Soldiers?
[Chalky] No.
does it contain fruit?
scones?
(though I'm not aware of any great abstraction attached to them)
Just got back this Sunday afternoon.
[metherer] It can.
[Brendan] No.
Another hint? The abstract version of this is the absence of the concrete version.
Fortune Cookies?
[Chalky] No.
Is the abstraction Douglas Adams-related?
Marzipan?
[Brendan] No. Nothing to do with any person or book.
[Chalky] No.
Does the concrete version contain a place name?
[Dazed5] No. The name of both versions refers to nothing but what the thing is.

I just checked that I didn't miss someone getting the right answer. I can't believe this is taking so long. I notice that I said it could be combined with anything, but I'm not sure that's true; it can certainly be combined with anything sweet.

A quiche or flan base?
A trifle?
A Gateaux?
[Inkspot,Darren,GL] No.
A bit of Crumpet?
[Inkspot] No. As far as I know, this thing does not appear in any figurative expression.
Muffin?
The words "Straws" and "Clutching" spring to mind
[GL] No.
I'll be away on a business trip from Wednesday afternoon to the end of the week. If no-one's got it before then, I'll just have to declare victory and reveal the answer.
Doughnut?
Wild screaming, clapping, cheering, and orgies in the aisles. Civilisation has risen once more, and soon, there will be lemon-scented paper tissues, and their flight can depart after a brief delay of 10,000 years.
[GL] Nearly there. What abstract thing is associated with a doughnut?
The doughnut hole?
[GL] !!!YES!!! Doughnut holes, referring both to the hole in the ring, and little blobs of doughnut fashioned as if cut out from the hole in the ring.
And you wonder why it took so long for people to guess?

Nevermind. The next item is ANIMAL.

Is it a mammal?
A long time to guess but it was a good conundrum.
Human?
[Inkspot] Yes
[Software] Yes
alive?
[sadie] No
Was english their main language?
[sadie] Yes
Male?
Sir Peter Ustinov?
Did he write a great many letters from America?
He's dead as well? Damn.
[Ink] Yes
[sade] No
[Raak] It's certainly not what he's famous for.
So... he might have written a number of letters from America?
[sadie] Was that a question? or a comment?
Did he die within this century?
Taking the view, for the sake of disambiguating, that the century started with 2000. It was merely a comment. With a question mark.
[sadie] No
Did he visit America?
Was he, in fact, American?
[sadie] He spent sometime in America
[BM] Yes
Was he born before America became independent?
Was he best known as an author?
[Bren] Yes.
[Inkspot] No
Abraham Lincoln?
[Software] See my answer to Brendan's question (independent - 1776. Lincoln born - 1809)
In other words, No.
Benjamin Franklin?
[Bren] No
Was he a publisher?
Was he of strictly European descent?
[Ink] I can find no reference to him having ever been a publisher
[sadie] As far as I can tell.
George Washington
It can't be that easy unless GL is feeling sorry after the last saga!
[Snodgrass] No
Caucasian appearance?
Was he ever president?
Are we talking present day USA? as oposed to the Americas in general?
Was he born before 1700?
[Snodgrass] Yes
[sadie] Yes
[Snodgrass] We're talking North America
[Inkspot] No
Thomas Jefferson
[sadie] No
James Maddison?
There's only so many it can be.
[sadie] I thought it would take a little longer than that for anyone to get it.
YES
It was Maddison 4th President of the USA and the first to be forced out of the White House during his first term. (The British burnt it down)

Very well, over to you sadie

Yay! Okay, now i've got a VEGETABLE for you.
Is it a turnip shaped like a thingie?
[Gusset] No.
Edible?
Is it something that has been man-made?
[Snodgrass] yes [Inkspot] yes
Does it involve eggs?
[Gusset] Not that i know of
Is it made from wood?
[Inkspot] No
Does it involve citrus fruit?
[Gusset] No
Is it a drink?
Does it contain more than one vegetable?
[all] Not generally, but i expect somebody out there is wierd enough.
[Software] Yes
Is it marmite?
Or Vegemite?
[all] Yes.
Marmite it is.
OK let's hope this proves harder. ANIMAL with ABSTRACT connections.
Is is fictional?
[sadie] Yes, that is the abstract connection
Is it part of some religious mythology?
Is it a dragon of some sort?
[sadie] No
[Raak] No
Is there a single fictional work (or closely-related set of fictional works) from which it comes?
[Brendan] Depending on your definition of "closely-related", Yes
Is it a fictional human being?
More than 2 legs?
Is the source pre-1950?
Does it's name begin with an L?
Is this closely-related set of fictional works all by the same author?
Is it Tinga and Tucka?
OK 40 somethings have wierd time warping memories. So sue me!
Is it a specific fictional animal belonging to a real Earth species?
Is it from a Marvel or DC comic book?
[GL] Yes
[Snodgrass] No
[Brendan] No
[Tuj] No
[Raak] Yes
[Snodgrass] Who? No.
[Darren] Yes, see above
[Inkspot] No
Less than 2 legs?
Who doesnt remember (Auntie) Jean Morton and her cuddly Koalas Tinga and Tucka? Shame on you! [Kids TV - 1960's]
[Snodgrass] No, and I wasn't born until 1979.
Female author?
Male author?
Female? (the fictional human)
[Inkspot] No
[GL] Yes
[Brenda]n No
J R R Tolkien?
[all] sorry about that. The 1979 bit I mean - you missed a great couple of decades there!
Is it adult fiction?
Snodgrass]One of the few children's tv with animals during 60's (other than Animal Magic) that I watched was Daktari with a cross eyed lion.
Is the fiction set in the real world?
[Snodgrass] No. I also missed a pretty reasonable couple of centuries
[Inkspot] Depending on your definition of "adult fiction". It is not adult in the sense that pornography is adult, but it is aimed at an audience that would be refered to as adults. Although of course it isn't entirely unsuitable for children.

I'll say Yes to make it simpler.
[BM] No
Is he the primary or title character of the set of works?
[saddie] Of his appearences in the set of works, only one was as anything other than the main character of the specific work.
Is it written in the science-fiction genre?
drawing a thin line between SF and fantasy novels.
[Inkspot] No
Is the fiction set on some version of Earth?
To clarify: the fictional worlds of Star Trek and Mad Max are both set in versions of Earth, whereas those of Star Wars and Narnia aren't.
[sadie] No, most 'alternate' Earth stories would be on the SF side of Inkspot's line.
Are the set of works books, or were they originally?
[sadie] Mostly
Cut-Me-Own-Throat Dibbler
In the same vein, Rincewind?
[Inkspot] No. He wasn't usually/ever the main character
[sadie] Not you again, Yes. it was Rincewind the Wizzard star of several Discworld novels and two computer games

Damn.
I have to think of something now.
Alright, people. Have yourselves a... MINERAL
Is it man-made?
Is it bigger than a phonebox?
[Gusset Login] Yes [all] Than a... yes, you freak of nature, you.
Is it made from more than one different material?
Stonehenge?
Shot in the dark, well its much bigger than a phone box and it will look lovely when its finished.
[Inkspot] Yes
[Snodgrass] No, but interesting guess. And in a wierd way, they are even connected...
Is it in the UK?
[Gusset Login] No
Is it in Europe?
[all] I think i can safely say no, it is nowhere in Europe.
Is it in Africa?
Is it made of stone?
[all] No, it's not in africa either
[Gusset Login] No
Is it a monument?
[Inkspot] No, but there are monuments to it
Is it made of metal?
[all] Yes, largely
Is it in America?
[Gusset] Not any more
Is it on Earth?
[Breadmaster] Nope.
Did leave Earth or get destroyed after 1990?
Is it a space probe?
[R.J.Fakename] No, earlier
[Inkspot] Not a probe.
Is it a Lunar Module from one of the Apollo moon (alleged) landings
Ooo, Controversial
or the Lunar Buggy from 15, 16 or 17?
[Snodgrass] Yes [the other Snodgrass] No, not a buggy
Apollo 11?
Are we trying each one in turn then?, 12, 14, 15, 16, 17?
Yes, it was the lander from Apollo 11, also known as The Eagle.
OK, lets try a bit of Animal
Is it human?
[all] Oh Yes!
Is it Soylent Green?
or however you spell it
Are they dead?
Is this a whole human or a part of a human?
[GL] No [all] Yes [Darren] Yes - a whole human (I'm feeling generous)
Fictional?
[Tu] No
European?
[Brendan] No
Male?
[Darren] Yes
Was he born before 1900?
[Inkspot] Yes
Was he born before 1800?
Politician/statesman?
[Darren] No
[Brendan] No
Australian?
Asian?
American?
[Inkspot] No
[BM] No
[all] Yes
Inventor?
a native American?
Writer?
President?
Ernest Hemingway?
[Brendan] No
[Inkspot] Yes (as in born there)
[BM] No
[all] No
[all again] Also No
Was he a Texan?
Snodgrass]A native american is more than having been was born there, more can be found here. Is the answer still Yes.
Did he die violently?
Really, "native American" should mean someone who was born there. The people who actually get called native Americans ought to be called "indigenous Americans", I'd have thought. Just goes to show that Americans don't know what words like "native" actually mean.
Was he born before 1850?

[Inkspot] No (born, yes, American Indian, no)
[BM] Yes
[all] I'll say Yes, but records are sketchy in this respect. I may revise this or confirm later. It would have been around 1850.
Did he die after 1900?
General George Armstrong Custer?
[Brendan] No of that I am certain
[all] No, but spookily his was a name on my list of possibles.
Did he die in the American Civil War?
Was he of caucasian appearence?
Was he a white man?
Was he a desperado or outlaw?
Henry McCarty, alias Kid Antrim, alias William H. Bonney, alias Billy The Kid?
[Brendan] No
[all] Yes
[Inkspot] In some respects Yes
[GL] No x 4
Was he assassinated?
[Tuj] No
Was he killed in a shoot out with the law?
[Inkspot] No
Was he involved in politics?
[Darren] No
John Wilkes Booth?
or maybe not, given the way he died ...
[Brendan] No not John Wilkes Booth.
Summarising: White male, American but not "American Indian", died violently before 1900, born around 1850, not political but (clue) fame has serious political aspect.
Lets go from here.
Was he a civil rights campaigner?
[Inkspot] No
Was he shot by firing squad?
Did he fight in teh american Civil War?
[Inkspot] No [Gusset] No
Was he executed?
[all] Yes
Was he electrocuted?
[Inkspot] Yes
William Kemmler?
[all] YES
Well done, the first electicutee in 1890. An axe murderer who killed his lover Matilda Ziegler (theres and actress with that name - in Mr Bean I think) in 1889. Sketchy records about him but it was a botched execution. They fried him twice. Mmmm Nice.

So when the applause dies down its over to you [all]
Thank you, Snodgrass
OK this one is an ABSTRACT with MINERAL connections.
Does is appear in a work of fiction?
all] *cheers ans clapping* Congrats on another good win.
[Inkspot] It would be inaccurate to say 'No', but misleading to say 'Yes'.
Is this an area of the Earth's surface (ie. a country, region, ocean, etc.)?
[Darren] No
Is it something represented in sculpture?
Rock music?
Is it connected to the word "Antarctica"?
Can it be percieved by any of the senses?
The pot of gold at the end of a rainbow?
Just popping in with my occasional and totally selfish wild guess.
Is it man-made?
Money?
Is the mineral connection an element of the same?
make that "...of the name"?
Sorry to ask two questions but it's been a while.
[Brendan] Not to my knowledge, but you never know with some artists
[Darren] No
[Tuj] No
[Inkspot] Not really, though it's causes often are.
[Dujon] No
[Breadmaster] One of the mineral connections is.
[Raak] No
[Darren] Yes, And don't worry about asking multiple question, especially over the weekend.
Is the mineral, which is a part of the name of the item, a solid?
[Snodgrass] One of them is, one of them isn't
Is it a phrase or saying?
Is there a maritime connection?
[GL] Yes
[BM] Not as far as I'm aware
Does it have a religious connection?
[Inkspot] No
A bottle/can (depends where you come from) of elbow grease?
"Like chalk and cheese"?
Salt of the earth?
Thinking that only one thing is solid how about a Bucket of Steam?
Getting blood out of a stone?
Is the non-solid mineral part of the name, a liquid?
[Snodgrass] No
[BIGSmith] No
[Raak] No
[Darren] No
[Darren] In part
Is the solid part stone?
Or is the solid a Metal?
and is it Edible?
[Inkspot] I assume you mean natural stone. No.
[Snodgrass] No
[Snodgrass Clone] No, but it is assosiated with something edible

Summary: A phrase or saying, that uses the names of two mineral items, one solid, one partially liquid. One man-made. Not linked to Antarctica, nor religion.
A glass of some cocktail, Vodka Martini (shaken not stirred) with Ice for example?
[Snodgrass] No
Is the partially liquid thing a viscous substance?
[Snodgrass] No
A gaseous or vaporous form of a liquid?
[Snodgrass] The part of the non-solid mineral item that is not liquid is a gaseous or vaporous form of the liquid.
The boiling point of water?
Does this object have a medical purpose?
[Inkspot] 100 degrees Centigrade, which has nothing to do with this.
[Snodgrass] I can think of no medical use for it.
A quantity of mud which, when thrown at a wall, will leave some still adhering?
[Raak] In what way is that an Abstract. And what kind of mud do you get 'round there? All the mud I've seen is viscous rather than gaseous or vaporous.
Are the solid, liquid, and vaporous parts, different states of the same substance?
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