[Stevie] On the other hand, when a disute arises, cancelling a direct debit arrangement is easier than cancelling a recurring charge to a credit card. A direct debit is an instruction from me to my bank, that I can revoke at will, without the involvement of the party I am paying. If they think I still owe them money, it's up to them to chase me for it. The same thing on a credit card is an agreement with the person I am paying, and I have to chase them to stop presenting their bills to my card issuer. This caused me some hassle years ago when I was trying to sever my relationship with an ISP that I could see was about to go out of business.

[pen] Do they use debit cards over there, or is it wads of cash only?

I hope it's not tulip bulbs again. That went badly wrong last time.

[Raak] Well, I honestly don’t know why anyone would set up recurring payments for anything. My memory of cancelling standing orders on UK bank accounts matches what you describe for credit cards. Innever set up recurring payments if there are any other options available. I think I had one annual one with Malwarebytes, but it expired with the card (replaced due to fraud).

Not only am I unconvinced on the preferability of debit cards, I still don’t understand how one hires a car without a credit card. Or reserves a hotel room. When I went to Canada I used a debit card, but it only worked because my US debit card could be processed as a credit card. The Canadians at the hotel and airline were adamant a Canadian debit card would not process that way and therefore would not be accepted for payment. I had to insist they tried each time I needed to do it as they didn’t think it would work.

So I ask again, how do you rent a car without a credit card?

Also, although you are right that an agreement tompay is with the seller, itbis negotiated via the bank who (with my credit record) guarantee good faith of the seller. I’ve disputed a few charges in my time with this bank, always resolved in my favor with a phone call to a toll-free number. I’ve executed three “charge backs” in my credit life too. That’s where the vendor does something sneaky and takes the cash, I argue with them for a bit and then ask the credit card company to get a refund for me. A single phone call, a discussion to demonstrate I’ve exhausted all other avenues, and a credit.

Just did one last week. I ordered a tool case before xmas. Never arrived. Each month I checked and the order was marked “open”. I sent three emails, one a month asking for an update, and pointing out how many emails I had previously sent. Instead of sending a fourth I made a call to the CC company and bang, that was the business. I got an email this week from the cheeky buggers I placed the order with, cancelling the order and telling me how sorry they were ... that I had cancelled the order. Not word one about how I'd made them an interest free loan for four months.

Hardly any cash any more - contactless payment is encouraged now, especially since Covid-19 made cash so filthy (I was a cash carrier by habit - always preferred to feel real money before I spent it). You don't even have to put your PIN in for anything under 50 euros. But the automatic egg-and-potato shop machine near the windy miller's windmill (the BEST eggs - you can wave to the chickens in the orchard as you drive past) still takes only cash. If I need small change (for example to leave the right amount of cash for my cleaner) I feed my bank notes from the ATM into the egg machine and get eggs and coins in exchange.
Don't ask me about ApplePay - that's beyond my knowledge. Probably more common in the cities but I don't go there any more.
And as I think I've said, you can hire a car with a credit card - I would imagine. Never tried it here.

But that won't put a lien on future responsibilities like a trashed hotel room or a dinged-up car. That's why Avis etc want to run a card here. And I wouldn't be caught dead using a phone to pull my cash out of my bank account. Two whole levels of potential screwery in one transaction - that could be the bank's problem instead. Matbe I'm super-sensitized from reading all the uckfups in the trade papers, but phone payments against a bank account? Madness.

According to This web site "Hiring a car in Netherlands is a must in order to get around. Debit card car rental can be tricky to find as it’s rare that you come across a company that will let you hire a car without a credit card in Holland. "

Which suggests that Holland is like anywhere else in that the norm is you need a credit card to hire a car (but that this company might let you do so with a debit card; restrictions apply). I knew Steve Martin couldn't be that wrong.

*lets Stevie ask questions and ignore suggestions while answering them himself*
It's like watching someone's Googling process in real-time.

[pen] Never mind that, tell us more about this amazing egg machine! Is it transparent-fronted? Does it have a many-lettered Dutch name?

Praying that everything goes well with the international payment and shipment for my laptop with linux. I'm having it sent to a friend's address because of this constant moving around. I'm excited as I have needed a good laptop and I like Linux. I have a much better time with it than Windows (and I have a much better time with Windows than I do with Macs/Apple products, but it seems both always want to just take your money). My tax return is paying for this. Here's what I ordered.
Clevo NV41MZ 14-inch Linux laptop
Processor: i7-1165G7 (2.80 tot 4.70 GHz – 4 Cores – 8 Threads – 12MB Intel® Smart Cache)
Grafisch: NVIDIA GeForce GTX-1650Ti - 4GB DDR5 - 120Hz display - NV41ME
Memory: 64 GB DDR4 @ 3200MHz CL22 (2 x 32 GB)
Operating system: Linux Mint 20.1 Cinnamon (64-bit)
OS Drive: 2 TB M.2 PCIe 4.0 NVMe SSD (Seq. Lees: 7000 MB/s, Schrijf: 5000 MB/s) Fastest choice
Full-Disk Encryption: No full-disk encryption (LUKS)
Language of Linux: English (default)
Notes: Can Zoom and OpenShot Video Editor be pre-installed on this, too?
Additional Software: Firefox, LibreOffice, Gimp, Skype, VLC, Audacity, Steam, Spotify, PuTTY, Calibre, digiKam, Inkscape, Kodi, LibreCAD
Wireless: Intel AX200 WiFi tot 2400 Mbps + Bluetooth 5.1
Keyboard: United States International QWERTY (with super-key)
Cooling Paste: Thermal Grizzly Conductonaut 73 W/mK
Power Plug: US power plug
Accessories: Additional 90W Charger (with selected plug), Free install/recovery USB with selected OS (32GB USB 3.2 gen1), External USB DVD-RW Drive
Warranty: 36 Months (3 years) Warranty + Free Pick-up & Return (EU countries only)

I'm not back in Lake Charles. My insurance on the side of getting my house repaired is being difficult. I'm in a hotel in Port Arthur, TX and on Friday, I have to move to a different hotel in that city.

The hotel where I am was very rude and let somebody come into my hotel room while I was gone when I didn't ask for housekeeping service (and I was in Lake Charles/Sulphur for a night because I had to take care of some things - and one thing was getting decent laundry bags so I could clean and do laundry) and they complained about "the condition of the room" because I have clothes on the floor and dog food out for my dogs.

Even after getting my key for my car, it was having the same problem again and I want to say it was "juttering" with starting/stopping and stuttering and kinda jutting here and there. I took it back to the mechanic that fixed the VVT solenoid and it needed a new air intake hose.

I have lots of fun with it being an art car and it makes me smile when I see it. I named it Hodge Podge (but it's a Honda and not a Dodge). I've got things all over it - things that are cute and inspirational - and there are a couple of little boys at my church in Bridge City, TX and their mother talks t them about the car and they put new things on it. I want it that way, where different people add things to my car.

There's hardly anywhere to stay in Lake Charles. There aren't apartments with places and there aren't hotel ready for any long term guests. I sure wish my insuranace would get on the ball.

[penelope] I remind the member from Windmill-on-the-Dyke that *she* was the one that said "Credit cards are hardly a Thing in the Netherlands" then prevaricated around the bush when asked an honest question about how that society handled fairly common stuff that absolutely requires a credit card Chez New York. Extraordinary claims and all that. I hardly think that having made a blanket statement about credit card usage in the Netherlands then forcing the audience to go and check for themselves qualifies one for the moral high ground and implied "let me google that for you" smugness harrumph harrumph.

[Tuj] Have you come across the Car Vending Machine?

In the days when currencies were multifarious, credit cards were a great way of avoiding having to carry various denominations around Europe with you. Except that some countries didn't believe in them, like Germany, where if you couldn't bite it wasn't money. My father-in-law drove down once and tried to fill up his car at the local petrol station, but they didn't accept credit cards, and pumped out of the exact quantity from his tank and told him to get lost. Later, when credit cards started to exist there, the company that I was working for there decided that everybody should have company credit cards, which they being American decided would be American Express. Unfortunately nobody within 100 miles accepted it, and they were all on the other side of a border.

Yes, I remember distrust of credit cards when I was young. However, I wasn't evangelizing their use to anyone else, just pondering the seeming national UK preference for debit cards and wondering about how some US-centric "credit card or on yer bike" stuff gets done in places where credit cards are not favoured.

So how is Brexit playing out in the UK? We only get the gleeful schadenfreude write-ups of the things that are reportedly falling apart. Is it still seen as the Last Best Hope for Peace

Hidden text

in our time

?

Not looking to start a fight I hasten to add. Just not getting the real story from the various sources I use. I don't care if you are pro or aginnit. The huge bloopers that the press love (fish, NI) must be masking other "smaller" wins no-one is writing about.

(Stevie) Brexit is off the agenda for the moment as it is now slowly dawning on people that maybe Boris is not quite the wholesome jolly fellow they thought he was, or, if they didn't but thought it didn't matter, they think it does now, a bit more at least. The front of Private Eye invites us to enjoy the carnage as Johnson and Cummings beat the shit out of each other. No wonder Boris didn't sack Cummings after the latter's optical quest in County Durham. Cummings probably knows a lot and is nasty enough to use it. Come on, Dom, do 'im over. BTW I hope you know over there pondwise what I'm on about.

WTF? I knew Brexit was going to be bad but didn't think it would get to this point after just 4 months.

You are a mere slip of a gel and do not remember the Iceland debacle.